Concealed carry confusion

"but I do not know anyone who was murdered for lack of a gun."

Caleb,come to where I work and I can show you hundreds of people who are in prison because their victims DIDN'T have a gun.

I can tell right away that I'm not going to convince you guys that you don't need guns, but here are those citations you asked for:

http://m.injuryprevention.bmj.com/content/9/1/48.full

http://m.aje.oxfordjournals.org/content/160/10/929.full

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0001457502000490

Every time this comes up, gun enthusiasts are quick to chime in about how they are a faster draw and a better shot that whoever might be out to harm them... Maybe that's true, maybe it's not. Hell, everyone gets lucky sometimes.

Here's another good one:

http://ajph.aphapublications.org/doi/abs/10.2105/AJPH.2008.143099?journalCode=ajph

"After adjustment, individuals in possession of a gun were 4.46 (P < .05) times more likely to be shot in an assault than those not in possession. Among gun assaults where the victim had at least some chance to resist, this adjusted odds ratio increased to 5.45 (P < .05)."

I can tell right away that I'm not going to convince you guys that you don't need guns,

Can you be convinced not to ocean kayak so you want get attack'd by a great white?

 

Do you have the full text of the 3rd and 4th articles?

Also the first and second articles are careful to use the word "association" and not words like "causation".  Why do you suppose that is?  As crash says, correlation does not imply causation, in this case association does not imply causation.

One could look at your "facts" in different ways.  The way you are interpreting it, those who own a handgun are more likely to be involved in a violent crime.  Or how about this way, those who are more likely to be involved in a violent crime, choose to own a gun.  There is a big difference between these 2 statement.  But the same "facts" can be used to back up both statements.

What true factors are involved in the likeliness of being involved in a violent crime.  Did gun ownership mitigate or aggravate these "true factors"?  Find me an article that explores this!

But IMO, that's neither here nor there.  Why do you want to protect me from myself?

-Allen

The time has come for me to not look at this post anymore

Gee ... I HAVE to keep looking at it, although from a mods point of view, you guys have been good.  I'll be sure to PM you the "good parts".

-Allen

The time has come for me to not look at this post anymore

Gee ... I HAVE to keep looking at it, although from a mods point of view, you guys have been good.  I'll be sure to PM you the "good parts".

-Allen

I am sure he is getting alerts every time someone quotes his post.  That's so nice of you to summarize and forward the best parts for review. 

Even if you have the right to carry not all should.  There are some stupid folks out there that would brandish or shoot at inappropriate times.  I even knew a couple in the military which had no business touching a gun. 

I can tell right away that I'm not going to convince you guys that you don't need guns,

Can you be convinced not to ocean kayak so you want get attack'd by a great white?

 

Nope. Great whites are a risk that I accept.

I also accept the risk that my wallet and cell could get stolen when I spend time in "sketchy" places. I feel SAFER in these areas without a gun because armed with just my words I don't pose much of a threat. I don't scare people. If I pulled a gun on someone, they'd get scared. Scared people don't usually make wise decisions.

"Why do you want to protect me from myself?"

Because, for whatever reason, I care about the wellbeing of others.

"Why do you want to protect me from myself?"

Because, for whatever reason, I care about the wellbeing of others.

If you truly care about the well beings of others, then stop down talking gun owners.  You do realize that more people die every year from hammers, drowning in pools, dying in car crashes then from a gun.

And when it comes to guns, there are no accidents, it is called being negligent.  Guns do not go off accidentally, people do not accidentally shoot other people.  If you want to be a victim, then go ahead and be a victim.  But as for myself I prefer to be prepared in the case I need to defend myself and my family.  No one knows when you will need to protect yourself, but I prefer to be prepared.  And the whole BS about not going to bad areas, or putting yourself in harms way is just more BS.  Bad people love going to "safe" areas to commit crime.  I hope I never have to pull my firearm, but the day I do, I will be very thankful it is there.

My number one rule with concealed carry, I will only pull it out when I am going to use it.  I do not use it to scare off people, I use it to stop people!

As for your statistics about if you own a gun you are more likely to get hurt by a gun, we'll duhh, that is only common sense.  If you own a car you are more likely to die in a car.  If you own a hammer, you are more likely to die from a hammer.  If you eat food, you are more likely to choke and die from eating that food.  That type of statistic is great for anti gun folks like yourself.  How about you worry about yourself and not worry about others.

Like others, I am done with this thread.  I am sick and tired of anti gun folks pushing their ways on to others.  If you don't like guns, then fine, but don't preach to me and others about how "bad" they are.

Yep!!^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

I'm not done with this thread. Statistics are fun.

Pirates are the cause of global warming. Specifically the lack of pirates. The pause in global warming is directly attributable to the increase in piracy off the Somali coast.

Graph that proves it:



We should stop patrolling and targeting pirates off the Somali coast. The fate of the world depends upon it.

"Why do you want to protect me from myself?"

Because, for whatever reason, I care about the wellbeing of others.

You care about your perception of my well being, which is markedly different than my perception of my well being.  You base that perception on "facts" that are manipulated to further your beliefs.  All I can say is that I don't buy into that and to please MYOB when it comes to my well being.  I mean that respectfully.

-Allen

Well this has been fun. Between this thread and the Annies debacle I'm learning a lot about the folks who make up this motley crew...

This is the last time I'll be getting involved in any politically charged discussions on this site. No one likes a one-against-many debate, especially when the jokes start flying.

Hope you guys at least keep your boom sticks locked up properly when you aren't toting them around with you.

Stay safe...

If we just ban cannons and cutlasses then we can reduce violent encounters and end global warming at the same time.

All it takes is some common sense medieval arms measures and we all win.