Covid-19 information - some statistics, models, and firsthand sources.

I would ask questions if I knew what questions to ask and to whom to direct them.

You can say that again.  I would rather be fishing and posting how I got skunked at Folsom Lake (again)

I blame the current situation on the forum to the person who suggested the idea to have a good winter thread....

So many questions that avoid a direct answer.

Maybe if you share a few more YouTube videos here, you can convince me one way or the other.

While you do that, I’ll focus on gathering information to help figure out how we can best move forward in the present and into the future amidst this incredibly challenging situation.

So many questions that avoid a direct answer.

Maybe if you share a few more YouTube videos here, you can convince me one way or the other.

While you do that, I’ll focus on gathering information to help figure out how we can best move forward in the present and into the future amidst this incredibly challenging situation.

oh good, at least I can wait for your expert guidance.  Let me know when you have this all figured out.  I'm glad you are in control of gathering the information.   (I don't recall reading what your credentials are to do this, but the way you avoid a direct opinion or answer to anything tells me you must be pretty high up the political ladder)

Yes. I highly value collecting and synthesizing the best available information so as to help my family and friends navigate the pandemic. You don’t need to be a politician to be a leader.

YouTube is littered with BS. I think the video you shared here is mostly BS. I bring up several reasons as to why I think it’s BS. But instead of referencing points in the video to show what I might’ve missed in my cursory judgement of it and remind me not to make cursory judgements, you’re doing…whatever you’re doing here.

I’m more interested in facts. You are more interested in winning. Can we just leave it at that?

Alright guys, its about time for me to get this thread locked down!   

DavidMel, I've told you this shit before and I'll say it again.  Would you please shut the fuck up?  JUST you, nobody else, just you.  Some of what you say makes sense sometimes, but its just the way you type/talk on here.  My fucking god, I bet you wouldn't be talking to some of these people with that bitch tone in person, so sit your ass down.   

The NIAID (that Dr Fauci heads) has funded and collaborated with China and the Wuhan lab (there is proof of this on the NIAID website).  Fauci denies that the virus was released from the lab and Trump insists it was released from the lab.  Who do you believe?

The above is a fact (not in a video).  Either way, I care about my family and friends surviving just like most of us.  I thought I asked a simple (yet loaded) question to move the dialogue forward.  It was not my intent to create a win/lose situation.  My personal opinion on both Trump and Fauci are negative, but I do know that if it were not for Fauci and Ian Limpkin, my wife may have been able to receive some treatment that would help her instead of having to watch her suffer for the last 13 years.  So all of this is not just about a bad virus to me. 

Alright guys, its about time for me to get this thread locked down!   

DavidMel, I've told you this shit before and I'll say it again.  Would you please shut the fuck up?  JUST you, nobody else, just you.  Some of what you say makes sense sometimes, but its just the way you type/talk on here.  My fucking god, I bet you wouldn't be talking to some of these people with that bitch tone in person, so sit your ass down.   

I here you, I here you.  Your tone definitely doesn't change so there is no doubt this is how you talk to people every day.

My tone is harsh just because it is personal to me.  My wife has an auto-immune disease that Fauci killed the research many years ago.  Dr Mikovits  was making headway on isolating it until he stepped in with a heavy hand and killed the research.  The part in the video about her being arrested without charge and what happened after is true.  So, I can't shut up.

•   Claim that there’s no way this particular coronavirus could be transmitted naturally from an animal to a human seems strange, as there’s ample evidence out there of other coronaviruses being transmitted from animals to humans.

Snipped for space. Note that in my very first post, I included a link to the study from 2018, showing that in 2015, antibodies for SARS-CoV-2's nearest "relative" were found in Yunnan villagers. No Wuhan virology lab needed...

So much bunk to be debunked.

P.S. Not that I don't think that this virus accidentally escaped from the Wuhan lab. I think the odds are better than 1:1 that it did. Accidentally. But this is just a scientific wild-assed guess.

P.P.S - I'm as guilty as anyone when it comes to heated internet bickering. But how about keeping this one thread as close as we can to just listing original sources - research papers, models, case/death counts etc...

It’s already been determined thru genetic sequencing that it did not come from any of the Coronavirus in Shi’s lab.
Good informative article about her Coronavirus work.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.scientificamerican.com/article/how-chinas-bat-woman-hunted-down-viruses-from-sars-to-the-new-coronavirus1/%3famp=true

Oh, I remember that article.  And as then, I feel there are lots of reasons to not blindly accept that pronouncement that the genome sequence from the Covid-19 patient(s) didn't match the ones from her lab.

Is hers the only virology lab in Wuhan? I recall there being at least two sites. How many different labs?
How different were the genome sequences? We know that SARS-CoV-2 mutates pretty quickly.
Is it possible that Shi could have been instructed to say "it did not escape from my lab"? One whistle blower is dead in China. The doctor that told him about the virus seems to have disappeared completely.

From a personal standpoint: I've lived in China. I've used/seen their infrastructure. I've used their healthcare system, been through their hospitals.  If they run their labs the same way they run their hospitals, well for me at least, it's quite easy to believe that there was an accidental release.

But, I do admit to not being certain. I just find it more likely than not.

The NIAID (that Dr Fauci heads) has funded and collaborated with China and the Wuhan lab (there is proof of this on the NIAID website).  Fauci denies that the virus was released from the lab and Trump insists it was released from the lab.  Who do you believe?

The above is a fact (not in a video).  Either way, I care about my family and friends surviving just like most of us.  I thought I asked a simple (yet loaded) question to move the dialogue forward.  It was not my intent to create a win/lose situation.  My personal opinion on both Trump and Fauci are negative, but I do know that if it were not for Fauci and Ian Limpkin, my wife may have been able to receive some treatment that would help her instead of having to watch her suffer for the last 13 years.  So all of this is not just about a bad virus to me.

This may mean nothing from someone you’ve never met, but you have my sympathies. If I put myself in your shoes, I probably wouldn’t be able to hold back my emotions. I put my loved ones above all else.

It’s incredibly difficult to objectively synthesize information when it relates to something close to the heart. I’m a biologist by trade, but I still struggle keeping my personal beliefs and feelings separate from the science and my work. In a situation like this, I remind myself to focus on the things I can control, and not to dwell on those I cannot. Regarding COVID, I can use information presented by experts to gauge risks and how best to approach them on my local level, and disseminate that information to my family and friends. I have no control over who or what is responsible for the virus, so its origins are relatively unimportant to me at this time.

Again, my sympathies to you and your wife.

The NIAID (that Dr Fauci heads) has funded and collaborated with China and the Wuhan lab (there is proof of this on the NIAID website).  Fauci denies that the virus was released from the lab and Trump insists it was released from the lab.  Who do you believe?

The above is a fact (not in a video).  Either way, I care about my family and friends surviving just like most of us.  I thought I asked a simple (yet loaded) question to move the dialogue forward.  It was not my intent to create a win/lose situation.  My personal opinion on both Trump and Fauci are negative, but I do know that if it were not for Fauci and Ian Limpkin, my wife may have been able to receive some treatment that would help her instead of having to watch her suffer for the last 13 years.  So all of this is not just about a bad virus to me.

This may mean nothing from someone you’ve never met, but you have my sympathies. If I put myself in your shoes, I probably wouldn’t be able to hold back my emotions. I put my loved ones above all else.

It’s incredibly difficult to objectively synthesize information when it relates to something close to the heart. I’m a biologist by trade, but I still struggle keeping my personal beliefs and feelings separate from the science and my work. In a situation like this, I remind myself to focus on the things I can control, and not to dwell on those I cannot. Regarding COVID, I can use information presented by experts to gauge risks and how best to approach them on my local level, and disseminate that information to my family and friends. I have no control over who or what is responsible for the virus, so its origins are relatively unimportant to me at this time.

Again, my sympathies to you and your wife.

Here’s a few tidbits on mikovitz
 https://mobile.twitter.com/acapellascience/status/1250630177278824454?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fd-472461028665832456.ampproject.net%2F2004252135000%2Fframe.html

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/scientist-vaccine-jailed/

It appears she’s a deep state/antivaxxer, looks like a frequent natural news contributor as well.
Not attacking the source, just providing some relevant background.

Clayman, thank you for understanding that for me this is close to home.  and I understand that based on many factors, my viewpoint does not match the mainstream.  But all I care about in the long run is that we can get back to a healthy "normal".  My wife and I have spent the last 13 years searching for answers with some progress and then having it pulled away too many times.
 

Wizz, if you watch the video and if you knew Dr Mikovits, you would know that she is not against vaccines.  She firmly believes that vaccines are part of immune therapy.  What she is upset about and opposed to is the way many of the current vaccines are manufactured and brought to market.  As long as I have known her, she has been very outspoken, driven and stubborn.  But then again, my opinions and views aren't formed by what I read and watch on the internet but from personal experience.

Alright guys, its about time for me to get this thread locked down!   

DavidMel, I've told you this shit before and I'll say it again.  Would you please shut the fuck up?  JUST you, nobody else, just you.  Some of what you say makes sense sometimes, but its just the way you type/talk on here.  My fucking god, I bet you wouldn't be talking to some of these people with that bitch tone in person, so sit your ass down.   

I here you, I here you.  Your tone definitely doesn't change so there is no doubt this is how you talk to people every day.

My tone is harsh just because it is personal to me.  My wife has an auto-immune disease that Fauci killed the research many years ago.  Dr Mikovits  was making headway on isolating it until he stepped in with a heavy hand and killed the research.  The part in the video about her being arrested without charge and what happened after is true.  So, I can't shut up.

Look, I actually agree with a lot of the stuff you say, even though I don't say it.  You notice I don't attack you about the content of what you post/say?  Its the way you talk to others and I can see why some people respond a certain way to you.  Anyways, its nothing personal and I understand where you're coming from...a little. 

I just want to say – you know – can we all get along? Can we, can we get along?

                                                                                                    Rodney King

Yes sharing information are great but this is just a kayak fishing forum...
Hope everyone stay safe, healthy & well

Look, I actually agree with a lot of the stuff you say, even though I don't say it.  You notice I don't attack you about the content of what you post/say?  Its the way you talk to others and I can see why some people respond a certain way to you.  Anyways, its nothing personal and I understand where you're coming from...a little.

Maybe that is why I don't have any friends. 

YouTube's become efficient at removing suspicious content regarding COVID, as they removed both the Kern County doctors video and now the Plandemic one. If they keep up the pace, is it worth the effort to critically analyze them here and clutter the thread?

IMO, if you share information here, you should also be responsible for vetting it. Putting in the effort to share it means you also put in the effort to critically analyze it yourself. It's unfair to wash your hands of it and shift the burden of (dis)proof onto others. I don't take pleasure in analyzing the videos, but I do it because I can't stand seeing people deceived into believing dubious claims that aren't backed up with evidence. The more dubious the claim = the more evidence required to back it up. Both the Kern County doctors and Plandemic videos severely lack in evidence, filling up most of their air time with statements of opinion. When you see this, it begs the question: why aren't they providing more evidence? Are there ulterior motives in play? Are they providing you verifiable information, or telling you what you want to hear?

If you dirty up some dishes, you should wash them. Don't leave them in the sink for your roommates to clean up.