Thinkin' of goin' solar..

All good info.  My 'field' placement would be PERFECT with almost no shade, ever.  The only downfall could/would be the power length run from the field to the main panel which is almost the length of the property (couple hundred yards) or about half that to our pole where the power is dropped from.  We are 3-phase, luckily.  Tracking solar wouldn't need to be an option for us because we have enough room to fully offset our use, plus surplus.  I haven't actually calculated any sort of kw per sq/foot or such to see what we could actually generate. 

We are looking for a new place with southern exposure.  One that we are looking at doesn't have a garage so a new carport / solar system may be an option.  When you say put an AC inverter at the panels is one needed for each panel or can many panels feed into one inverter.  Are they designed to be put out in the weather or stored in a building.  I wanted a battery back up also and would like the batteries and panels in the same area but the power coming into the house would be a good distance away.

Here is a good design calculator required to be used by the state of California by all solar marketers so that they don't over sell you a system.

http://www.csi-epbb.com/default.aspx

You can plug in my info for an idea of what it does;
zipcode 95623
solar panels; SolarWorld:SW 275 Mono Black
number of panels; 18
inverter; Enphase Energy:M250-60-2LL-S2X (-ZC) (-NA) (240V)
number of inverters; 18
array tilt 22 degrees
array azimuth 160 degrees

Hit the 'go' button and it will provide a monthly chart of generation against optimum generation.   This will show differences between where you have to place your panels and the perfect panel placement.

Also notice that the Annual kWh produced is 7,108kWh.  That is for 18 panels that are rated 275 watts output.  Ideally that would produce 9,033 kWh.  (275 x 18 is the panel output.  That is 4.95kWh of generation.  Now take 4.95 x 5; the number of hours the sun shines per day on the panel averaged for the year.  That is the daily generation of 24.5kWh.  Now take 24.5x365 and that is the yearly generation; 9,033kWh.

You can see the calculator under states the max potential of my system by 20% or so.  I can realistically expect my solar to replace 80% of my power usage. 

If I truly want 100%, I'd have to add more capacity with panels.  This is why I'm going with a system that distributes the inverters with micro inverters at each panel; I can expand easily.   

We are looking for a new place with southern exposure.  One that we are looking at doesn't have a garage so a new carport / solar system may be an option.  When you say put an AC inverter at the panels is one needed for each panel or can many panels feed into one inverter.  Are they designed to be put out in the weather or stored in a building.  I wanted a battery back up also and would like the batteries and panels in the same area but the power coming into the house would be a good distance away.

One microinverter at each panel.  They attach under each panel where the existing interface box on the panel resides;
Here is a link to them;
https://enphase.com/en-us/products-and-services/microinverters

These won't work with battery back up since there isn't DC access.  The panel DC is converted to AC internal to the micro box that is mounted under each panel.

If you are remote locating your solar panels from your electric meter, you can install a central single inverter, with the batteries in the barn, then run AC back to your house and the meter there.

However, if you do decide to go with a central inverter so you can add batteries, consider using a power optimizer at each panel.  Here is a comparison of the two technologies;

http://www.solarelectricsupply.com/solar-inverter/microinverters-optimizers

I'm still considering using the power optimizer over the microinverter due to it's higher efficiency.  Also, the power optimizer is Israeli technology.  Those guys know what they are doing AND they are NOT chinese. (See RANT above)

And with risk of violating any rules on this board, if anyone is thinking of meeting up with a company, let me know and I can give a referral.  I get a kickback and you will too.  PM me about the contact. 

We're thinking about going with the optimizers from the company in the 2nd link. They gave a nice presentation an I was impressed. We can run up to1000VDC strings out here which is nice since we need 480VAC. Each string would have an inverter.

Something to consider when contemplating a solar design on your roof;
Code in California requires that the panels be set back from the ridge line by 36".  Is for firemen to have access to vent the roof if needed. 

Of course, the best place to mount solar panels is the ridge line area..... 
36" setback might be too much to build a 100% offset design on smaller houses or two story houses that don't have a huge roof.

I'd like to see them try & put a set on my second story roof.  It is a variable pitch AND variable shape (on purpose  )  No part of it is flat or square or parallel. 

We're thinking about going with the optimizers from the company in the 2nd link. They gave a nice presentation an I was impressed. We can run up to1000VDC strings out here which is nice since we need 480VAC. Each string would have an inverter.

I really like the microinverter aesthetics without the centralized inverter.  The three parts of any inverter system, the MPPT (Maximum power point tracking a technique that inverters of grid-connected solar systems employ to maximize power output.), the DC-to-DC converter and the DC-to-AC inverter are all remoted to the individual solar panels.  I also like the potential to expand when I add on to the house in a few years.

The idea behind SolarEdge optimizer is to split the traditional inverter into two parts. One is the DC-to-AC stage which they put in a box that goes on the wall. The other two stages, the MPPT and DC-to-DC, are put on the roof. So it’s basically 2/3rds of a micro-inverter.
The reason for doing this is that the hard part of  inversion is the last stage, DC-to-AC, because it needs all sorts of energy storage in the form of capacitors. So if you leave that out of the rooftop portion of the system, you’re left with the MPPT and DC-to-DC, which is a lot smaller and more reliable. Meanwhile the “prone to failure” part, the DC-to-AC with all its capacitors, goes on the wall, where it’s easy to service and not subjected to the heat. This also provides a convenient place for all the associated bits and pieces, like monitoring and communications.

I touched on monitoring and communications at the end of my last post.  I'd like to expand and explain what that is.

With either the microinverter or the optimizer system, there is software embedded in the devices that you can access via a computer program or smart phone app.  They use wireless wifi connection and if you have a wireless router in your home, your installing company can monitor and troubleshoot remotely.  You can literally monitor each solar panel's performance and even set alarm points to alert you if a solar panel and it's associated equipment has changed or failed.  Most folks wouldn't know this on a conventional system until the electric company sends you a bill, once a year, that reconciles your power usage.  Ideally, this would be near zero dollars, but what if a solar panel failed?  You could have hundreds of dollars in electric utility costs that are due. 

Here are my plans.  They use 16 of the SolarWorld 315 watt panels, the Solar Edge optimizers on each panel with a centralized inverter and various misc. materials to get it on the roof and connected to the main panel.

This will provide me for around 95% of my electric load.  Parts bid is $10,542 and would need to have added to that price the cost for permits and PG&E inspection fees. 

I've got a bid on a turn key system using the same parts for $18,500.  The installed system includes a 25 year warranty and a 25 year guarantee of system performance, all permits, inspections, contacts with PG&E, etc are all included.  I do nothing but drink a beer and bitch that they dented my gutters.  The warranty covers any leaks to the roof as well. 

After the 30% tax credit, the turn-key system price drops to $12,950 and the self-install to $7,380

I would say go overboard a little on cells and batteries. We have plenty of juice in the summer but have to run the generator occasionally in the winter, especially if it's cloudy for extended periods of time. Was thinking of combining wind with our solar. Been here since '85 and was never hooked into a power grid.

hey Jerry,

As we discussed the other day, the quote I got for a 5.25kW system was $10754.49 for a 20 year fully prepaid lease through Sungevity, before a $950 additional promotional discount.  Trina 250 panels x 20 panels.  Since its a lease, production is guaranteed for 20 years as well as warrantied.  Since its a lease, they get to keep the tax credit (good riddance) and the difference in cost between purchasing the system and leasing it was about $7500, which is significantly more than I would have received with the tax credit.  Only problem is they're chinese panels, but since its a lease I'm not as picky.  After 20 years, they will take panels off or you can buy them back. My guess is they won't want them back.

I also got a local guy to send me a quote for a purchase and install of $20950 (+3% cash discount) for a 6kW system using 20 Trina 300s, so based upon my calculations that was $2.34/installed watt.  But his system was central inverter + tigo optimizers.  I found his quote through Energysage, which is like an online marketplace where installers can bid on your system.

Thanks Ben!  I'm just now getting into research on the lease options.  My head hurts....

Having played with solar for a while, you will probably get the least costly hardwares......get educated first . Seriously.

My family went the way of renting. They installed everything and even payed for  the inspectors. We have not even had it for one year and have saved about $100. Yeah, that's not much, but when winter comes that savings will rise.  We have not paid $0.01 out of our pocket for the set up or anything else. We just get the savings. I looked deep into the contract and it reads that's my price is locked for 10 years.  Also, when I decide to sell the house the buyers have 3 options; 1) buy out the system for their own, 2) renew the lease 3) have them remove everything.

Since we are not planing on living in this house for more than 10 years and solar helps on resell value on the house it just made since to do it this way.
Yeah there is a lot of info out there; however it just makes since that the sooner you do it, the quicker you should be saving money.
If anyone if thinking of going renting feel free to ask me any questions about it. 
And I'll end this with.... Sorry if been gone for awhile.... thanks to "Life"   .