Surf Perch for Bait?

Last week I was fishing for rock fish, around Pillar point harbor, outside of the break water.  Being a newbie, I wanted to get the sensation of catching my own bait.    So I put on a size 10 sabiki line and went out.  I caught 4 silver surf perch right away.
     My question is:
     1.  Can surf perch be used as bait, and for what fish?
     2.  What else is there to fish for in the Princeton by the sea area?
    I tried using squid on a two hook rock cod setup and the squid wasn't getting hit at all.  Then I put on some frozen anchovies and I kept getting them taken off.  The hook seems to rip them apart.
     1.  How are you supposed to rig frozen anchovies so that you are not just feeding the fish?
    What rockfish setups seem to be working for you?
     Any help would be appreciated.
Thanks

I'm pretty sure you can't legaly use surfperch as bait, but I could be wrong.

The DFG is notoriously confusing with this issue.

Best to call the local office and ask.

MolBasser

Aren't Shiners perch and you can use them for bait.

Its all tangled up in what the DFG terms a "game fish".

Game fish cannot be used for bait.

One example is spotted bay bass, which I know several people use down south for big halibut.  Can't legaly do it according to the DFG.

But you can use mackerel as bait.......

Best to just ask the DFG.

MolBasser

Shiners are a type of surfperch and you can use them for bait.   In fact, the limits are much higher than other surf perch for just that reason.  You can even use traps and nets to catch them (as you would other bait species).

As for other species of surfperch that are considered game fish (i.e. they have catch limits) and I don't believe you can use them for bait legally.

Rockfish seem to be an exception to this gamefish rule in that it's hard to prevent a ling from hitchhiking.  The rule for rockfish therefore seems to be that they count towards your limit of rockfish if they get "used for bait".  The fact that DFG can't distinguish between accidental hitchhikers and intentional ones has led them to the conclusion to allow it.  With surfperch you'd pretty much have to switch rigs from a perch rig to catch the perch to a rockcod or halibut rig to use it as bait so they'd be able to tell.

Brian

Thanks, that was a better explanation than mine.

MolBasser

I'm pretty sure the bait restriction is a freshwater reg.  There is nothing in the Ocean Regs about not using game fish for bait.  My understanding has always been that any fish, except for tilapia, can be used as live bait as long as you count it against your limit and is of legal size (if the fish has a limit or legal size).  Can anybody point to the reg restricting game fish as bait?

I just checked and it looks like you're right.  I was confusnig the legal use of baited traps to catch staghorns, mudsuckers and shiner surfperch (presumably as bait) with which species could be used as bait.

I specifically called the DFG about this, and you cannot use gamefish in fresh or salt water for bait.

At least that is what the agent told me.

In specificity, I was asking about spotted bay bass as bait, and you can't do it.

It very well could be that that particular agent is wrong.  I will call the DFG at 9am today and try to get an answer.

I will ask if you can use barred surfperch (gamefish with limits) as bait for leopard sharks as I know this is a practice (legal or not) that occurs.

MolBasser

I have to say I think the guy you talked to is wrong.  The size limit for those is 12 inches, though, right? (actually the reg says 12 inches total or 8.5 inches alternate length.  What is alternate length?) . .. so you could not use a baby spottie or anything like that.  Same for greenling . .you could use a 12 inch greenling as bait (1 per day).  I am pretty sure about this but I have only non-dfg sources (that, and no written reg that I can find against it).  By the way, this is just an academic thing . .I don't use greenlings as bait!

Yes, the limit is 12" and we talked about that.

He said that if it was legal to use them as bait (and he said it wasn't) that I would have to use a legal fish of 12" or more.

It was a long detailed conversation and he was specific about not being able to use gamefish as bait, but like I said, I will get on the horn to the dfg up here.  Right now in fact.

MolBasser

Of course, no one was at the enforcement desk.

I will update when they call me back.

MolBasser

Not to hijack (well okay, to hijack but with a related theme),
but my recent re-reading of the regs suggests I can have two rods out until I have a rockfish on board.

This means you can leave a halibut rig out until you pull a rockfish on board.

For us aimless drifters with no fish finders having two rods out until we connect with fish is attractive.

Ask them that one mol, cause having two rods in capitola/santa cruz, one with kingfish one casting would
be a lot more fun.

I got a call back from DFG but didn't actually talk to the agent.

His quote was that any fish could be used for bait in salt water except tilapia.

 

Why can't this organization get its story straight?

I called back to try and talk to him personally and had to leave another message.

Stay tuned.

MolBasser

Jmairey,

That's how I read them as well.  Although, I think there is a lot of lee-way for wardens to interpert intent and then give you a ticket.  For example, fishing with two rods that both have shrimp flies is probably going to be seen as fishing for rockfish with two rods.  However, as you mention fishing with mutliple halibut rigs would be fine and fishing with swimbaits or other lure that works equally well for halibut and rockfish would be fine as well (until rockfish are on board).

Brian

Brian