What is the spirit of AOTY?

For me, someone who is trying to broaden my fishing horizons, AOTY is about finding the motivation to make a serious attempt to learn to fish for new species. This is my first year competing, and my goal is to catch as many species as possible.  Living in the bay area, I think I live in such a diverse area as far as fish species is concerned and I want to learn to catch them all and take full advantage of where I live.

As far as ATD's sturgeon, I say let it ride. I've been fishing for sturgeon and am not excited about keeping 40+ pounds of heavy-metal laden meat. I literally am fishing for a bottom feeder that can live a long time behind a chemical factory on the delta.  If you catch a keeper and can provide pictures that show that you made a good effort to capture its length, and it's obviously legal- good enough. Sturgeon are hard to come by, I doubt this will be that common of an issue. The AOTY committe should review sturgeon entries on a case by case basis if the person decides to CnR. If you are having a ton of trouble getting an accurate pic of its length and you want points for it, well, your just gonna have to keep it. And just know going in, that if you decide to CnR a keeper, you might not get credit for it if your picture isn't deemed good enough. That's the gamble of CnR. These are just the thoughts on AOTY sturgeon from someone actively competing. And that's the beauty of the Internet, any random person (me) can spout off about whatever! Peace!

... but who am I?

You are ADAM, THE GREAT WHITE CONQUERER!  And a fine man in my book... we're talking about character, not looks btw.
Peace 2 U

... but who am I?

You are ADAM, THE GREAT WHITE CONQUERER!  And a fine man in my book... we're talking about character, not looks btw.
Peace 2 U

An OG and legend of the Pacific, just like those big fish you see on shark week.

I'm having flashbacks of BMB's AOTY sturgeon from 2-3yrs ago. Same deal right? C&R legal sturgeon with 'insufficient photographic evidence' despite the witness account. What happened to that fish? If it was DQ'd then maybe this one s/b too. Otherwise, let it ride! Looks legal to me. With a credible witness, too. I bet a vote by AOTY participants would result in allowing the fish.
Adam, if it gets DQ'd or you choose to withdraw it--I will show you where to catch a 14" crappie which is strangely worth more pts. 

AOTY Committee:Man up, to prevent like problems in the future,
                           What issues do you have with the photo/witness?

Man up about what Tad?  Not sure I appreciate the tone of your emails.

Look guys, nobody is out to get anybody here.  The AOTY committee is deliberating the entry.  It is very difficult, confusing, and stressful to both us and ATD.  ATD wants to do the right thing.  The AOTY committee wants to do the right thing.  The objective metrics in question here may conflict with personal decisions on what the "right thing" is to do.  It sucks.  That's life.  Can we skip the drama?

-Allen

Polepole,

 I DID NOT send you (or others) any e-mails about this issue,
and I don't appreciate you stating on an open public forum that I did.

I know.   You'll see that I changed my original post before you posted up.  I saw that in ATD's response and changes my post, but didn't want to edit his.  Sorry about that.

As far as my "tone", maybe "man-up" was too strong and a poor choice of wording for some,
and it was not my intention to "create drama".
My apologies to those who may have taken offense!

"Man up" implies a weakness or lack of doing something strong.  I'm not even sure what manning up has to do with anything here.
 

My intention was to clarify 2 questions,
1. What was the committee objecting to in the photo with a witness there to verify the measurement?
2. Are AOTY competitors on the committee?

I am removing my "offensive" post and avoiding any further AOTY discussion.
Peace my brothers,
Tad

In general there is no need to debate individual entries on the open forums.  If someone has a problem with an entry, send us a PM and we'll deal with it directly with the person who entered the fish.  Most of the time, things gets settled just fine.  And that is happening in this case too.

But since this comes up.  There is no clear photographic evidence of the length of the fish.  There is really no debate about that.

And yes, AOTY competitors are on the committee.  The integrity of the members both individually and as a group is high enough that it doesn't need to be called into question.  The goals of the committee are 1) set the rules for the next years competition and 2) vote on actions taken when an entry is called into question.  The 2 main questions asked are a) is there clear photographic evidence and b) is the mouth more than in a "natural position".  The first one is pretty easy to determine.  The second is a little more subjective and why we vote.  I can assure you that nothing like collision is going on.

Anyone want to take over AOTY next year?  This is getting tiring ...

-Allen

I believe in the spirt of AOTY, although I can say that situations like this make me question it at times.  IMHO when the rules changed this year on sturgeon, it's now not worth targeting them unless your going to keep them, or basically it now sounds a lot harder to reasonably CPR them which is the only way I really want to fish for sturgeon.  I feel like Adams situation was created by this rule change, where as before when the rules were:

2. Photographic evidence of fish size (total length with mouth closed) must be provided. For sturgeon, in the absence of a photo of the fish against a measuring device, a photo of the fish against an object of known size along with measurement that is witnessed and verified by another person in the pool will suffice.

To:

2. Photographic evidence of fish size (total length) against a measuring device must be provided. Fish must be measured in a natural position with either the mouth shut or slightly ajar. The mouth can not be pulled/extended open. Abuse of this rule will result in that entry automatically being disqualified. The AOTY committee will make final rules in this regard. There is no longer an exception for sturgeon. Clear photographic evidence against a measuring device is required for sturgeon now.

Why was the part dropped about having another AOTY angler as a witness?  I recall a certain sturgeon entered in the past where there wasn't even a picture of a fish on a measuring device, but it was confirmed by someone in AOTY as a witness.  No one complained about that one to my knowledge...   We are supposed to be trusting one another in this game...

I must say that AOTY has been a great challenge and learning opportunity for me and the last three years of participating.  It's been a great way to challenge myself to see out all these new opportunities, visit new bodies of water, learn new fishing techniques, and have fun competing along side the best fishermen I've ever had the privilege of fishing with.  I can say with complete honesty I've never posted a fish I wasn't proud of, that wasn't caught legally, that had it's mouth flared open on purpose, or with any assistance from another angler, etc.  I couldn't I enjoy this competition if I was trying to cheat... or if I didn't trust the guys I'm competing against!

Hey it's not like he posted a tiny out-of-season rockfish  (which someone else did back in January and it stayed up for weeks)

My .02.
FWIW, I will not respond to any comments to my .02. It's just my .02 and it won't change.
When I first heard Adams sturgeon might be DQ'd I thought....wtf????
I know how many times he has been out. I know about his shortie, his oversized, the stripers and so on.
Trip after trip the man has made and finally his persistence paid off. He's a kick ass fisherman and I knew he would finally score.
I was so stoked for him; you have no idea. Seriously, NO idea.
But when I looked into the reason it might be DQ'd, and I saw the photo, I knew right away the reason. The photo just plain sucks.
I discussed this with Adam.
Do I think the measurement is accurate? Oh HELL ya!
Do I think he and Rob are up to any shennanigans?? HELL NO!
Is there any doubt in MY mind about the length of the fish? None whatsoever.
But I don't think that is what is at issue here.
I cannot see the head of the fish and I cannot see where the tape measure starts.
If the fish is accepted by the merits of the photo alone then everyone should all be allowed to enter 1/2 a fish photo with no beginning point of measurement.
If the fish is accepted because of the character of the individuals who presented it; then that would put into question the character of anyone whose fish was not accepted that submitted a similar photo.
Has anyone checked the current memeber list? THOUSANDS!
Not everyone enters AOTY, I get that. But what's fair for one should be fair to all.
What about the guy who isn't as well known? He submits a similar photo and it is immediately DQ'd. What is he supposed to read into that?
"They took that one guys photo. Why not mine? This is BS!
Or the guy who may want to add a few points (because lets face it, it only takes one) and intentionally doesn't photo the head of the fish or the measuring start point; how many of those photos do we take from that guy?
It's kind of like locking your kayak with a lock that really isn't all THAT hard to get passed. It's there to keep the honest people honest.
No matter what decision is made you won't make everyone happy.
And for those of you who make a snap decision to drop out because a decision may not have gone the way you wanted it to; well, that's your decision. But just try to put yourself into the shoes of the others and see if you can come up with a plan to make everyone happy.
I think it's a shitty position for all involved and clearly there will be no winners....unless Adam takes me up on my offer to take him out. I won't catch squat, but whoever goes with me usually does. 

I will take over AOTY next year. No problem at all! Any complaints go to the complaint department...

Now just to make sure everyone understands this is a joke. I don't have any intentions on blowing anyone up. This is a joke.
And my grenade doesn't have a primer or any powder.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I will have to say this has come up before and is why you will never see me or most of my crew in AOTY. I truly respect those who compete in the AOTY but there is a dark side to multi-day high stakes fishing tournaments. In the cabo billfish tournaments, a randomly selected crewmember has to pass a lie detector test. We are better than that and I trust any NCKA member to be honest At the end of the day, it's not about winning. I am happy for Adam would take his word as truth as I would any NCKA member. Let's move on and hunt some salmon.

Scott

I think we need to end this topic and move on. It makes me sad and sick to my stomach that I am to blame for all this because of a fn picture. Adam and I both knew that the picture was the best we could do. We even wondered if it was good enough. We wanted to let the fish go ASAP and this was the result. The following is the last you will here from me about this.

From now on pics need to be perfect or not even submitted. Not a single one of us should have to feel like I feel right now. We have all made some great, long lasting friendships in this club. The only thing this kind of stuff does is drive a wedge between what we have here. We always go back and forth with each other about a lot of things, usually in fun.  This time the fun part is not there. Let's just move on and be the one huge, multi cultural, fun loving family that we really are.

Good night, Rob

I think we need to end this topic and move on. It makes me sad and sick to my stomach that I am to blame for all this because of a fn picture. Adam and I both knew that the picture was the best we could do. We even wondered if it was good enough. We wanted to let the fish go ASAP and this was the result. The following is the last you will here from me about this.

From now on pics need to be perfect or not even submitted. Not a single one of us should have to feel like I feel right now. We have all made some great, long lasting friendships in this club. The only thing this kind of stuff does is drive a wedge between what we have here. We always go back and forth with each other about a lot of things, usually in fun.  This time the fun part is not there. Let's just move on and be the one huge, multi cultural, fun loving family that we really are.

Good night, Rob

Rob, you are not to blame.  I asked you to take the photo since I didnt have a free hand.  It was my decision to release the fish, and I am the one who let it go.  I could have kept it, found a place on the shore to lay it out and measure it.

Don't feel bad about it.. at all    Now I get to chase sturgeon with you again.. once we make enough cash and WAF to pay for another trip. 

Pilot Slough is a jealous mistress.

I am still new to this club, I really enjoy reading all the stories along with the reports, I love looking at the videos and pics. I learned a lot from many posts, I improved my kayak by looking at the pics and your ideas, I would like to participate and meet a lot of you guys that share this healthy passion and say thank you for your advise, but never knew how much controversy was on the AOTY. I don't fish enough to be competitive, I don't have the experience to try to compete and not look like the amateur that I am and honestly it seems intimidating, I would like to contribute to keep this site going but AOTY is out of reach for me.
Maybe there is more people out there that may feel the same way and would contribute in another way, How about a raffle after every event to raise some funds for the site, somebody out there is doing a lot work and should at least get a new computer or monitors every now and then.

Luis

I am still new to this club, I really enjoy reading all the stories along with the reports, I love looking at the videos and pics. I learned a lot from many posts, I improved my kayak by looking at the pics and your ideas, I would like to participate and meet a lot of you guys that share this healthy passion and say thank you for your advise, but never knew how much controversy was on the AOTY. I don't fish enough to be competitive, I don't have the experience to try to compete and not look like the amateur that I am and honestly it seems intimidating, I would like to contribute to keep this site going but AOTY is out of reach for me.
Maybe there is more people out there that may feel the same way and would contribute in another way, How about a raffle after every event to raise some funds for the site, somebody out there is doing a lot work and should at least get a new computer or monitors every now and then.

Luis

I like this idea.  I think I am gonna go the Kayak Wars route instead of AOTY next year, but I would still like to contribute to the site.

keep the entry fee, take out all the prizes....

Then it will just be about angling.