Mothershipping, Big & wild? Not kayak fishing at all?

The comment I heard by the skipper of the Islander is that we northerners took our Kayak fishing to the extreme in comparison to others who have chartered through them.

When we got to San Benito we were all psyched to fish. The captain said it was too rough.
"Too rough?? Are you kidding? This is what we are used to."
Unfortunately he was the captain and not from NorCal. 

I think a good example of a difficult definition of purity in our subculture is the Hobie mirage system. I have a huge amount of admiration and respect for some of the NCKA that choose to fish from this platform but do I think that they are kayaking? no I dont. But do I think they are having a great time? most definately.

I have to agree with Terry.  Pedaling a Hobie is not true kayaking if you're not exclusively using a kayak paddle for propulsion.  I always feel like I'm somewhat cheating every time I see my paddling bros struggling in the wind while easily pedal my way around.

New technology has a way of slowly changing opinions though.  Take California Canoe & Kayak for example.  It's one of biggest pure paddling snob shops I know.  They're now selling more and more Hobies and their sales guys are eventually changing their opinions to meet the preference of their customers.

I like the Hobie Adventure because it's the only Hobie Mirage Drive Kayak that actually paddles as good or better than some paddling yaks.  It's paddles significantly faster than my similar length Malibu Extreme and sometimes faster than my OK Prowler 15.  I've done time trials to prove it.  With all that said... when I'm using the Adventure, I'm pedaling 90% of the time.  The pedal drive is just too much fun, efficient, and convenient.

I feel for my pure paddling bros.  I really do.  I often enjoy the purity of paddling a good kayak... just not all the time.

Are you going to get a Adventure Island?

 I think that's my next rig.....

I think a good example of a difficult definition of purity in our subculture is the Hobie mirage system. I have a huge amount of admiration and respect for some of the NCKA that choose to fish from this platform but do I think that they are kayaking? no I dont. But do I think they are having a great time? most definately.

I have to agree with Terry.  Pedaling a Hobie is not true kayaking if you're not exclusively using a kayak paddle for propulsion.  I always feel like I'm somewhat cheating every time I see my paddling bros struggling in the wind while easily pedal my way around.

New technology has a way of slowly changing opinions though.  Take California Canoe & Kayak for example.  It's one of biggest pure paddling snob shops I know.  They're now selling more and more Hobies and their sales guys are eventually changing their opinions to meet the preference of their customers.

I like the Hobie Adventure because it's the only Hobie Mirage Drive Kayak that actually paddles as good or better than some paddling yaks.  It's paddles significantly faster than my similar length Malibu Extreme and sometimes faster than my OK Prowler 15.  I've done time trials to prove it.  With all that said... when I'm using the Adventure, I'm pedaling 90% of the time.  The pedal drive is just too much fun, efficient, and convenient.

I feel for my pure paddling bros.  I really do.  I often enjoy the purity of paddling and a good kayak... just not all the time.

I think we are getting off thread, however, for those who don't have the upper body strength, the hobie mirage system allows others to participate in our sport who may not be able to otherwise and that is a good thing, IMO. We may have an AOTY, but for most of us it is really not a competitive sport. It is about having fun and hanging with cool people, regardless of whether you use a paddle or mirage drive.

scott

Are you going to get a Adventure Island?

 I think that's my next rig.....

Danglin.... you're opening another can of worms to make the paddling purists gag.

The Adventure Island gives you the option of sailing, pedaling, or paddling.

What's our NCKA bros going to say when we're zipping around the bay with the sail to get from one fishing hot spot to another?

Ooops... sorry folks... I got off the subject.  Now, let's get back to the topic of Mothershipping.....

What's our NCKA bros going to say when we're zipping around the bay with the sail to get from one fishing hot spot to another?

 " Yee Haw!!!! , I Gots ta Get me One of Those... "

Like any other kayak fishing, mothershipping is what you make of it. Sure, you can hang by the boat all day, just like you can fish right off your launch beach. However, due to the time and expense involved in mothershipping, damn straight you better plan on a long day of paddling. These trips visit special places. If you don't take advantage and paddle off to the horizon in the hunt for big fish, well, you're missing out on a chief benefit of hopping on a big boat.

Bottom line, most of my longest sessions, real dawn to duskers, have all been off the mothership.

I don't think anyone is dissing the Islander trip...  not me anyway.  I would have been there with you all if I had the cash to spare, and I was very jealous looking over the pics!

So what is different about mothershipping?  I think it's right here:

I loved the fact that I was a radio call away from the Mother ship and that if I was parched or out of bait they were there to assist.

Out on your own, you don't have that luxury.  Forget your favorite lure?  Sunblock?  Feeling seasick?  Tough titty!  I found this out the hard way my first trip in the salt...  and now I'm hooked for life!  It's the thrill of total self-sufficiency.

So yes they are both kayak fishing, but it's like the difference between having a guide show you the spots and having to figure it out on your own.  Both have their place.

I don't think anyone is dissing the Islander trip...  not me anyway.  I would have been there with you all if I had the cash to spare, and I was very jealous looking over the pics!

So what is different about mothershipping?  I think it's right here:

I loved the fact that I was a radio call away from the Mother ship and that if I was parched or out of bait they were there to assist.

Out on your own, you don't have that luxury.  Forget your favorite lure?  Sunblock?  Feeling seasick?  Tough titty!  I found this out the hard way my first trip in the salt...  and now I'm hooked for life!  It's the thrill of total self-sufficiency.

So yes they are both kayak fishing, but it's like the difference between having a guide show you the spots and having to figure it out on your own.  Both have their place.

Great Eric's think alike!   

Well said.

I don't think anyone is dissing the Islander trip...  not me anyway.  I would have been there with you all if I had the cash to spare, and I was very jealous looking over the pics!

So what is different about mothershipping?  I think it's right here:

I loved the fact that I was a radio call away from the Mother ship and that if I was parched or out of bait they were there to assist.

Out on your own, you don't have that luxury.  Forget your favorite lure?  Sunblock?  Feeling seasick?  Tough titty!  I found this out the hard way my first trip in the salt...  and now I'm hooked for life!  It's the thrill of total self-sufficiency.
So yes they are both kayak fishing, but it's like the difference between having a guide show you the spots and having to figure it out on your own.  Both have their place.

Great Eric's think alike!   
Well said.

So if I am on the water and I forget sunblock, a lure, maybe a leader and I borrow some from the guy I am paddling next to I guess I am kayak fishing with a guide based on your scenario because I just cashed in on a 'luxury' by getting it on the water when it was not on MY kayak.
Or maybe my partner should just say " tough titty!" it is all about total self sufficiency.
Because I didn't bring a beer with me on my kayak I should turn down a beer offered to me by another kayaker?
That's weak.
Just so I totally understand your point of view; from now on I should not give or loan anything to anyone else because that would take away from their thrill of self sufficiency?
Guess that means that you were on a guided trip at Tahoe when we went together and you were paddling MY T160 Abking..

I absolutely do not understand why you guys are throwing dirt on one another.
This thead is crazy.
It should be erased.

PURITY.........!!!!!!..............key-rist.......

Alright, you all more-or-less know that I drive a sit-inside kayak.
According to legend it was this Inuit indian invention that was called a kayak.

I should lord it over YOU and call myself pure and you impure...???...!!!...

The SOT is a development of, an improvement upon, the conventional decked boat.     

Decked boats offer a degree of warmth that SOT's don't have.
You can design a SOT with "rocker" and use it with knee-straps, and if you wanted to you could narrow it to make it rollable....I will NOT claim that SOT is less viable in whitewater.   You'd just have to modify the SOT design a bit.

You also, could if you wanted, design 17-foot 21-inch SOTs...and they would be fast....and every bit as tippy as a decked boat.....maybe a tad tippier because the CG would be elevated a couple inches.

My goodness......now in this thread I've seen guys arguing that somehow, a SOT that's designed to be peddled (propulsion system).....is less pure than one that is paddled.     These arguments are empty-as-the-wind, of course.

Now with regard to motherboats.....lets say a guy has a physical paralysis, say from the waist down.   And his motherboat captain "cradles" this guy's boat with him in it in hoist-straps and lowers it to the water.     Is this dude any less a "kayaker" than the one that does a seal entry from the 8-foot high motherboat fantail?

And with regard to motherboats......you cannot sleep overnight in a kayak....not any kind of kayak.     (Well yes, you COULD put out sponsons...jeeeezzz...)    So practically speaking kayaks are limited as "coast-side" craft......a transport mechanism where you've just got to put in, come the end of the day.     Fine....the motherboat though, gives you a floating platform to put-in to.

Are some of you saying that that is .........wussy.....????........
Or is that just plain intelligent, as an extension of the capability and range of your craft and hobby....???....

Honest dudes.....
This thread is a very very bad thread.
None of you has called one another a bad name yet, but that's next.....

No no.
You are kayakers.
It's good.
Leave it.

Judd

I must disagree with this last post. I thought this was a good thread that brought up some thought about how we attempt to label our lifestyle. It allowed strong yet harmless opinions offered and all were polite. The only dirt throwing I can find is in this post and ive got 2 hands full.
Judd, maybe you should try to go fishing instead of just bitching and maybe contribute something other than unvalidated rantings.
nuff said

Guess that means that you were on a guided trip at Tahoe when we went together and you were paddling MY T160 Abking..

Uh, YES!  And it sucked, you jerk - you wimpy,... mothershipper!   

No, Judd's prediction has not come true with me.  Mike, I love you, man!  Thanks again for letting me cruise your T160 - I had a great time, and that was kayaking and NCKA at its finest.

When I applauded Eric B's post it was how he pointed out that the Islander sounds like a great time, and it was obviously an example of mothershipping that is indeed great kayak fishing, but I also agreed that, as Eric put it so well, "It's the thrill of total self-sufficiency."  I like that thought a lot, and it really hits home with me.  But I also cherish the chance to share time with a guy who's so cool that he'd bring me a superior yak to the one I had with me, and buy me a sandwich, and send me his kid's old wetsuits for my little kids. 

Judd's not right on, but part of what he's said is right - this thread is getting a little destructive, but we can handle it, we're grown-ups, and, at the end of the day, a lot of us care about each other.  I dig that more than any of the debates, and I dig the debates a lot.

So, after hearing the arguments of people I highly respect and reflecting on the reasons that I feel a little differently, I'm changing my vote.  Mothershipping IS true kayak fishing - it's not something that represents my ideal, but, when done right, it has a place as a "pure" form of kayak fishing in my opinion.

I need a freakin' 12 step program for my AOTY sickness!   

I need a freakin' 12 step program for my AOTY sickness!  

Hey, My name I Frank and I am addicted to Kayak Fishing !
Everyone reasponds; Hey Frank

Judd we love to argue. it's not only therapeutic we all learn a lot. We really do get along great when were on the water, it really doesn't matter what we say here it's really a personnel decision anyway. Differences of options and beliefs is what makes this group so great. just because I said mothershipping isn't what I want kayak fishing to be for me doesn't mean I won't do it and have a blast it's all good fun and fishing is fishing and blogs are blogs don't take either too seriously it spoils the fun.

Hey if I paddle out 3 miles and catch a fish is it eligible for AOTY since technically I'm not in Norcal?