Drysuit in flat freshwater; wetsuit in ocean?

Most of my early kayak adventures will be on relatively flat California freshwater rivers and lakes in warm weather; am I correct that a drysuit and suitable footwear would be appropriate / best outerwear?

I intend to begin exploring the California saltwater with classes, clinics, and guide trips; am I correct that a wetsuit (freedive suit with hooded top that can be turned down to the waist and booties) topped with a drysuit jacket and hat would be appropriate / best outerwear?

Saltwater wear also most appropriate / best in colder weather or water regardless?

I will of course be wearing a pfd, hat, and have other safety / survival gear / supplies.

Thanks for advising a newbie.
 

Let's see... warm freshwater lakes.... wear shorts (and a PFD of course).  These are sit-on-top kayaks and if the weather is nice and you still flip over you might get a little cold at first but should be able to right the kayak and get back on without trouble and then dry off.  Bring a dry bag with warmer cloths in case you need them (sun goes down, wind picks up, etc..)

Saltwater... yep it's cold.  Most of us wear wetsuits becuase, well, they're warm and are a hell of a lot cheaper than a good drysuit. However, if I had an $500-800 kayak dry suit I could wear out in the ocean, I think I'd use it... way more comfortable, warmer, and easier to get on and off.  Of course, I guess I'd have to worry about fish hooks and rockfish spines puncturing my suit.  If you still want to wear the wetsuit to be like the rest of us, be sure to also have a good windbreaker you can wear over it... sitting on top of your kayak in a wet wetsuit with any sort of breeze will chill you to the bone without one.

Brian

have to worry about fish hooks and rockfish spines puncturing my suit.

Steve...I mean Brian  is on the money with that one. I ruined my fist pair of breathable dry pants because of those dam rockfish spines 

You can also keep your butt dry in the ocean by wearing a cheap pair of seam sealed rain pants (helly hansen - da best) over your wetsuit  - just cut 'em into shorts so you don't have to worry about water seeping in when you stradle your yak 

For the lakes I have become a big fan of 100% nylon pants. The kind where the legs zip on or off depending if you want to wear long pants or shorts.This is great when you have had too much sun. They dry super fast and do not absorb a lot of water and are light weight enough so you won't overheat in them. I wear a pair of Tevas and bring along the pump spray kind of sun tan lotion. This way I can always get the tops of my feet, my face and neck without having to rub anything on my hands. Quick and easy.
I agree wuth the above post about the ocean. Wetsuit, wetsuit, wetsuit.

I think it is up to you what you wear, and where you wear it. You'll figure out what makes the most sense for your personal situation. As for when, there is the "rule of 120". If the combined temperature of the air and water is under 120 - You have to be wearing some sort of thermal protection against immersion. If the combined temp is under 120 - then leave the neoprene/goretex at home.

I have a drysuit that I purchased for WW rafting/WW kayaking/general sea kayaking. And I use it and will continue to use it for fishing in the ocean. But I'll probably save it for days when I know I'll be paddling a long distance, and the weather is forecast to be nasty. Otherwise, the wetsuit/paddle jacket combo is just fine. Its more robust and is much less expensive. But you just got to love that drysuit comfort

Scott

After reading some posts, I wonder why you would want to bring the change of clothes with you; why not keep them dry in the vehicle. after dipping my legs into Blue Lake water and having my legs go numb i like 30 secs.; anything other than that water is warm and friendly, but I wear shoes or bootys because of slippery condition and because I can take them off and not track around muck or water. I really like the NRS Over-Jacket; it is a pull-over design and fits nicely over my PFD. The M-tech I have as sunscreen/wind break wear works great but can start becoming hot when the temp increases.

Well, bit the bullet.  New wetsuit.  7mm, one-piece, 3X back entry Aqualung, plus separate hooded vest.  Suit a bit tight in the shoulders, but they tell me it will loosen up with use.  Also got dive gloves, suit and accessory hangers, and a large mesh duffle bag in which to haul everything around.  Sticker shock.  Have to go back for some pool time with the gear to figure out dive weights – they think I might need over 25 pounds!

Together with an NRS paddling jacket, an inexpensive Stearns waterproof/breathable pant-and-jacket set,  and my breathable Orvis chest waders, I guess I have covered my likely alternative needs and am out of excuses.  See you on the water!

Crew (aka darn cat) did an amusing double-take when he saw the wetsuit hanging on my weight machine; thought I brought home a very dark and quiet stranger.  (Crew: no, for a second I thought the old crab had molted!) 

Stockton Don,

I hate to break this two you, but your new suit sounds great for scuba diving off the yak... but...I think it might be a bit thick (restrictive motion) and probably way too warm for just a day of kayak fishing.  Personnally,  I use a 3 mm while kayak fishing... it's warm enough for the occasional dip, but not so hot and restrictive like my 5 mm.  I couldn't imagine paddling in a 7 mm.  Even for spearfishing, I'm not sure what suits people wear, but I'm usually fine in my 5 mm diving for abs and I think some of the guys only use a 3 mm of diving too.

Figuring out the dive weights in the pool might be of little help for the ocean.... be prepared to take a few extra weights with you to compensate for your extra bouyancy in salt water.  I'm not sure the exact bouyancy difference, but maybe someone on this board might know.

Brian

bsteves

I went over all that with these guys, and with another supposed freediving guru in another store.  They  all steered my to this gear and even told me they use it diving and kayaking themselves. 

I was assured this was the proper gear for freediving and doing so out of a kayak.  It's supposed to be super-stretchy and as comfortable as any non-custom suit can be.  I originally asked for 3mm and both places said that I would freeze with less than 7mm. 

They said I should buy at least 4 or 5 pounds of extra weight for saltwater.

I'm going to get the weight thing handled this week and give everything a hard workout this weekend.  They already know I have significant reservations about the shoulder fit.  If it does not work, back it goes.

P.S. It would be a rare day for me to stay out of the water.  I like to dive when I fish.  Also, my kayak is primarily pedal- and sail- driven.

I really appreciate your advice and opinions, I'll take all the help I can get!  I'll let you know how it goes.  Thanks.

StocktonDon,

Sounds good.  I had this fear that you might have been steered into getting a stiff 7mm scuba suit. I suppose I could have looked up the model you said you bought to find out more.   Stretchy is key at least for paddling, but with the hobie mirage drive you don't have to worry too much about that either.  I don't do a lot of free diving myself (although I have plans), I've always been comfortable paddling around in my ultra cheap 3 mm surfing wetsuit and free diving in my 5 mm. Many of the guys on this board just wear a 3mm farmer john with a paddle jacket.  The few times I've been out in my extra stretchy 5mm suit I was okay paddling, but got very hot.  So hot in fact that I jumped in the water just to cool down.

Brian

I was steered to a 7mm also but not for the hot days but the cool winter weather, but they told me to get a 2-piece for the times you have to take a leak.

Do you guys provide a floating leash for those times you stray from the yak?

I have a dive line that I figured I would attach to the anchored kayak, with the other end attached to ab iron or speargun or whatever.  Planned to put a dive flag up on the sail mast.  Also have a small dive float with flag and another dive line if I decide to roam a bit more without moving the kayak (not too likely), or dive without the kayak.

How do you guys handle things?

The following is my opinion and as such should be considered in light of the fact I was a sea kayaker first and a kayak fisherman of late.

Drysuits are pricey and delicate but ideal for the cold North Pacific. At and below a certain water temperature, the thickness to prevent life-threatening heat loss in the water and the thinness needed to paddle effectively over long periods in a given air temperature (as well as flexibility to allow freedom of movement) are simply mutually exclusive and the ctwo urves don't meet. Perhaps fishing paddling requries less exertion and less-continuous paddling lowering that inflection point on the water temperature curve, but its more true and occurs higher in the curve for serious sea kayaking. With a modicum of insulation in a good Goretex dry suit, you could hang out for hours and not even notice the cold--I know I've done it during rough water training in sea kayaking seminars in 56-degree water up North. So I swear by one for sea kayaking in closed-deck boats in cold water where tidal races and rough seas might mean immersion for an extended time as I self-rescue or re-nter and roll. It is simply a margin of safety I am reluctant to surrender.

However, my dry suit so far has stayed at home while I fish and I use a 3-mil wet suit in the ocean and bay and lighter ones or none at all in lakes. The reason is simple: my dry suit is the Kokatat expedition (with hood) and at $990 I don't want a hook puncture to ruin it or cause patching to be required. A closed-deck boat is a serious water boat and a capsize in condition I cannot roll-up in means enxtended immersion. For a open-deck boat, I expect less immersion time and a wetsuit seems more practical from an insulation and economic standpoint. Hook punctures are not financial setbacks nor do they threaten insulation.

Most of my early kayak adventures will be on relatively flat California freshwater rivers and lakes in warm weather; am I correct that a drysuit and suitable footwear would be appropriate / best outerwear?

I'm sure it has been posted, but you will roast to death in a dry suit on lakes are rivers in california 98% of the year.

I have paddled in shorts and a T shirt 80% of the time on freshwater, and the other  20% of the time was in sweats and a sweatshirt.

In still water like lakes there is absolutely no need for splash wear or fancy pants or anything like that.

MolBasser

I hear ya MB. I expect to see no wet suits tomorrow at Lexington. the only times I have worn a wet suit in a lake were at Crowley for the season opener and Eagle Lake in late October when snow flurries where flying and the lake temp was 53--both times fly fishing for Trout.