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Topic: Learned a new knot and some knotty words  (Read 11535 times)

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The Gopher

  • Salmon
  • ***
  • Location: Santa Clara
  • Date Registered: Mar 2018
  • Posts: 866
Was slacking off with my work Copilot agent, whom I've named Starbuck and instructed to refer to me as Ahab, and learned something new.

Starbuck informed me that dropper loops retain ~70% of line strength, and that's what I've always used for dropshot/hi-low rigs. This came with a suggestion to try surgeon's loops instead, which I hadn't heard of (only knew a surgeon's knot).

My hi-low/dropshots with 30 lb Trilene Big Game mono have had a good track record of not breaking with a fish on, and I can barely remember times when the failure was at a knot. Usually it's the loop that breaks at the hook or weight if it breaks at all and it was probably from fish teeth sometimes. Using 40 lb instead of 30 would obviously be tougher to break, but it's nice to be able to break 30 lb free from an intractable snag without having to pull as hard as with 40, which often results in a bent hook getting me loose rather than broken line.

The surgeon's loop allegedly retains more like 85% to 90% of line strength. They are also quick and easy to tie, so I'm wondering why nobody here told me about a surgeon's loop before!!! :smt006 :smt044 :smt003

For a hidebound traditionalist, switching to a new knot is like ditching a friend who is only running a few minutes late at the harbor launch.

Another bit of new info was that my way of securing a hook to a loop by passing the loop through the eye and around the hook is called a larkshead hitch or loop hitch.
"The snot green sea. The scrotum tightening sea."


Tsuri

  • Sea Lion
  • ****
  • It's spring!
  • Location: East Side
  • Date Registered: May 2009
  • Posts: 2148
AI is not your friend, in this case I think you're already using the correct knot for how you are fishing and agree you shouldn't ditch your friend at the harbor launch who is running a little late.

Hard to describe but I'm going to try anyways, the dropper loop runs the loop 90° off the side of the strait main leader line whereas the surgeon loop has the main leader line running back on itself which is more likely to cause the hook and loop to tagle on the main leader line especially with the double loop/hook configuration. I use the dropper loop on my frayed rope shrimp flies and my experience is the same as yours, the line typically breaks near the hook were the hook or fish have a compromised it almost never at the knot.

I use the surgeons loop almost exclusively to attach the weight to the leader.
 
« Last Edit: March 12, 2026, 05:52:14 PM by Tsuri »
In training to be AOTY 2035
Stealthy since 2017
Crabbing is work!


The Gopher

  • Salmon
  • ***
  • Location: Santa Clara
  • Date Registered: Mar 2018
  • Posts: 866
Thanks for going over that, Tsuri!
"The snot green sea. The scrotum tightening sea."


JoeDubC

  • Sea Lion
  • ****
  • Location: Walnut Creek
  • Date Registered: Apr 2020
  • Posts: 2183
All that knotty talk goes over my head. 
Hobie i9 - sold
'21 Hobie Outback Papaya
Hobie Lynx

If a seagull poops on you, statistically it was no accident.
2024 NCKA AOTY
2025 NCKA AOTY


johnz

  • Salmon
  • ***
  • Location: Alameda
  • Date Registered: Jul 2014
  • Posts: 612
AI, the end of all human creativity and analytical thinking as we know it.
John
Hobie Revolution 16


 

anything