NorCal Kayak Anglers
Kayak Zone => Kayaks => Topic started by: hitt025 on May 09, 2021, 12:27:10 PM
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I can't decide on whether to get the Outback or the PA. The cost doesn't really matter much and the weight difference isn't an issue. But which is better for the Bay Area and Ocean for fishing? Any PA or Outback fishermen, please share your thoughts. Thanks
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Myself I would say Outback! The 19 I have has met every fishing need I have thrown at it !
Plus way easier to transport!
Good Luck on ur decision!
Scotty
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outback is more than enough boat for everything around here.
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For the ocean, definitely Outback.
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Wow, three votes for Hobie Outback. I like the Outback too but thought maybe the 360 option was enticing. Thanks for all the feedbacks.
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Wow, three votes for Hobie Outback.
Yeah, well Steve and Brian kill it with them, but the PA is kinda like:
:smt003
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Another for Outback. Got mine this year and it has been a pleasure to fish. I decided on an OB because deck/rail layout, weight and price,...in that order. I’ve been able to set it up perfectly for my fishing needs and it is super easy to maneuver confidently. I do not fish the salt, but quite happy how it performs in large wind chop and deals with power boat wake. You’re gonna have fun with whichever you choose!
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I am not an expert by any stretch of the imagination, but do have experience on the 360 flavor ...
If you are navigating tight spots like docks, weeds, lily pads, and sunken stumps then the 360 has an advantage, but only because you have that extra level of maneuverability the motor thrust offers.
Ocean fishing has none of that - as you're threading your way through tramp steamers, squillion dollar yachts, and the Exxon Valdez, whose oil slick is visible many miles away - and therefore not much of the navigational hazard.
I would think the larger boats (greater than 14') would also make a more stable platform for the salt.
I own a PA and love it - except when I have to carry the lead arsed beast into the water or out of it. Builds muscle - and character ... but doesn't help you fishing.
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When I guide people on PA's we have The Talk first - I explain that if their drive fails and wind, current and/or swells keep them from effectively paddling the beast, they may have to anchor it up and hop on my kayak to get back to shore.
Outback = the state of the art for the sport at this point.
PA is too big.
Good luck~
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Not a lot of support for the PA. I see two used Outbacks (2019 and 2020) for sale online. They come pre-rigged with some nice fish finder, (9” lower ace elite Ti2 & other one comes HELIX 10 G3N Fish Finder), wheel cart, rod holders and other gears. But they’re $4k and $5k. I guess with all the accessories they could add up fast. The question is do I want to buy new and rig every the way I like it or buy it used and just get in the water to fish 😃
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Instinct suggests that if you're spending four of five grand, the resultant boat had better be to your liking, as that's a lot of cheddar to drop to find out you should've bought something else.
You don't need all the bells and whistles to fish, you need the stuff necessary to make you fish safely and efficiently, and the Cappuccino maker with the frothing foam attachment can wait for later.
I bought new and am learning the capabilities of the boat, it's hull and propulsion, before adding anything additional. Each subsystem tends to have its own quirks, and I've found that learning the basics, before buying the fancy stuff, gives additional wisdom and insight .
You don't need an anchor trolley to learn how to rig or free a snagged anchor, you simply need the experience of flipping your craft when you pull too dang hard in frustration.
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... Cappuccino maker with the frothing foam attachment can wait for later.
Yes, but the microwave is essential.
Personally, I'd go for new or bare-bones used, as rigging it just the way you like to is part of the fun.
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When I guide people on PA's we have The Talk first - I explain that if their drive fails and wind, current and/or swells keep them from effectively paddling the beast, they may have to anchor it up and hop on my kayak to get back to shore.
Outback = the state of the art for the sport at this point.
PA is too big.
Good luck~
PA - waaayyy too big and heavy.
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Outback. But then again I keep threatening to sell my outback and go back to a revo or maybe even a stealth….
In all seriousness the outback works really well for everything. If I were solely a freshwater bass guy and I only launched at nice boat launches I would go with the pro angler. If I only did remote launches in random places I would go revo (strictly talking Hobie here). The outback is a nice middle road. It paddles okay, it’s heavy but somewhat manageable, and you can stand in it.
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Not a lot of support for the PA. I see two used Outbacks (2019 and 2020) for sale online. They come pre-rigged with some nice fish finder, (9” lower ace elite Ti2 & other one comes HELIX 10 G3N Fish Finder), wheel cart, rod holders and other gears. But they’re $4k and $5k. I guess with all the accessories they could add up fast. The question is do I want to buy new and rig every the way I like it or buy it used and just get in the water to fish 😃
Another thing to consider is can you find a new one...
I was talking to Billy@ WindToys and he can’t keep em in stock, you’ll have to wait for some time till it’s delivered...
$4-5k is alot of $$$ but addd on’s do add up
Meaning $303 for wheels, $300-500 for fish finder,plus whatever other goodies you add.
The outback does have alot of bells and whistles built in which is also why I Love it!
Scotty
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Another vote for Outback. New or used doesnt matter as long as they are in good condition and 2019 or newer.
Spend the extra money on a motor ..... 3 - 2 -1 .... :smt068
But in all seriousness, the Outback is pretty complete. Not as fas as the Revo but definitely faster (and lighter) than the PA. You can take it through difficult launch, a lot easier than the PA.
If you do get the motor, make sure that you can get back with the fin in case the motor fails.
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I don't even have a outback, I have a Compass.! From what I have seen...
Outback for resale value
Outback for lighter weight
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Thank you for all the valuable feedback. It helped me finally decide on the Outback. I'm not going to second guess myself once I make the purchase.
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Outback vote here 👍... My 2018 camo edition holds plenty of gear and then some.
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Redundant answer but another vote for the outback. It’s a fish slaying machine with much more options/ opportunities then you even need to get to the fish. The PA seems great but I don’t like the additional weight it carries. Pulling that thing over sand or up a slippery ramp sounds unappealing. And for the most part it won’t get you no further, no faster, or any more stable.
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I wonder how many Outback owners don’t realize they have 8 handy knife holders already built in!
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I wonder how many Outback owners don’t realize they have 8 handy knife holders already built in!
I am always afraid whatever you put in there might pop out and go swimming :)
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Another vote for Outback. New or used doesnt matter as long as they are in good condition and 2019 or newer.
I have an older (2010) outback and love it, can't imagine needing more boat, bigger seems more of a curse than a blessing in this case. Curious though to know why 2019 or newer, what happened in '19?
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Another vote for Outback. New or used doesnt matter as long as they are in good condition and 2019 or newer.
I have an older (2010) outback and love it, can't imagine needing more boat, bigger seems more of a curse than a blessing in this case. Curious though to know why 2019 or newer, what happened in '19?
The newer hull/deck design is a such a big improvement. Except for the rudder IMO
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Another vote for Outback. New or used doesnt matter as long as they are in good condition and 2019 or newer.
I have an older (2010) outback and love it, can't imagine needing more boat, bigger seems more of a curse than a blessing in this case. Curious though to know why 2019 or newer, what happened in '19?
The newer hull/deck design is a such a big improvement. Except for the rudder IMO
2019+ is faster, easier to add any add-ons, and easier to handle due to the new handle in the back (especially for loading).
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Another vote for the outback. Lighter easier to launch and transport. And plenty stable. My buddy bought a PA14 360 and it is a beast of a Kayak and takes about twice the effort to move anywhere.
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Another vote for the outback. Lighter easier to launch and transport. And plenty stable. My buddy bought a PA14 360 and it is a beast of a Kayak and takes about twice the effort to move anywhere.
That’s good to know about the PA 14 feedback. Yeah, when I’m loading and unloading, most of the time, it’ll be just myself. So Outback being will be a benefit.
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Another vote for Outback. New or used doesnt matter as long as they are in good condition and 2019 or newer.
I have an older (2010) outback and love it, can't imagine needing more boat, bigger seems more of a curse than a blessing in this case. Curious though to know why 2019 or newer, what happened in '19?
The newer hull/deck design is a such a big improvement. Except for the rudder IMO
The deck layout, with all the built on rails, is what got me - makes ot super easy to customize without a whole buncha DIY futzin and drillin. The rudder isn’t terrible, but yea. I’m going to upgrade to a metal rudder of some sort after this season. I’ve been yearing the helloutta mine - been fishing more than ever “thanks” to covid.
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Another vote for Outback. New or used doesnt matter as long as they are in good condition and 2019 or newer.
I have an older (2010) outback and love it, can't imagine needing more boat, bigger seems more of a curse than a blessing in this case. Curious though to know why 2019 or newer, what happened in '19?
The newer hull/deck design is a such a big improvement. Except for the rudder IMO
The deck layout, with all the built on rails, is what got me - makes ot super easy to customize without a whole buncha DIY futzin and drillin. The rudder isn’t terrible, but yea. I’m going to upgrade to a metal rudder of some sort after this season. I’ve been yearing the helloutta mine - been fishing more than ever “thanks” to covid.
Yeah, I bought mine with bass fishing in mind. I have a Revo16 dedicated for ocean fishing except crabbing. What I hate about that rudder design is how it sticks out. You need to be mindful when moving it around or when launching and landing. Other than than, I really like it.
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Another vote for the outback. Lighter easier to launch and transport. And plenty stable. My buddy bought a PA14 360 and it is a beast of a Kayak and takes about twice the effort to move anywhere.
That’s good to know about the PA 14 feedback. Yeah, when I’m loading and unloading, most of the time, it’ll be just myself. So Outback being will be a benefit.
What hasn't been discussed is righting a PA should it flip. I followed a fellow to shore who was swimming behind and pushing his upside-down PA14, because, as he explained "I can't flip it over if I'm not standing on the bottom..." and he wasn't a little guy. Gig Harbor Fly Shop - a Hobie dealer - had a video online of their struggles to right a flipped PA - it took quite a while.
(Yes, I offered to tow him and his boat back to the beach but he declined.)
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The PA12 is friggen luxurious. You can stand sideways on the seat to pee. I e never been on a PA 14, but I bet you can walk around. :)
I’d go outback for sure. I really enjoy the weight if my Compass. Not sure I could stomach that much more weight if a PA. I am however very tempted to buy an outback. Haha.
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no experience on an Outback - but many here have given good advice on that.
I've had my PA14 for a few months now, only had it on freshwater so far, 5 lakes of various size, various wind, and various waves/wakes. I've been really happy with it so far. it is heavy, but I'm able to get it on and off the top of my car without any issues - so it is not a problem for me. I've had various canoes and kayaks for the past 20 years, and fished from them all - the PA is my favorite so far. Looking forward to getting out on the ocean.
someone mentioned issues with righting a capsized PA - I can see how this would be challenging, i'd approach it the same as I would a small sail boat, have a line tied to one of the H-rails (in place of the mast), throw it over the bottom, and climb on the other side while pulling on the rope - the whole thing should flip over at that point. I'll play around with this when the weather warms up and I feel like playing in the water.
there are so many good fishing kayaks on the market today - you really have a bunch of good choices
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no experience on an Outback - but many here have given good advice on that.
I've had my PA14 for a few months now, only had it on freshwater so far, 5 lakes of various size, various wind, and various waves/wakes. I've been really happy with it so far. it is heavy, but I'm able to get it on and off the top of my car without any issues - so it is not a problem for me. I've had various canoes and kayaks for the past 20 years, and fished from them all - the PA is my favorite so far. Looking forward to getting out on the ocean.
someone mentioned issues with righting a capsized PA - I can see how this would be challenging, i'd approach it the same as I would a small sail boat, have a line tied to one of the H-rails (in place of the mast), throw it over the bottom, and climb on the other side while pulling on the rope - the whole thing should flip over at that point. I'll play around with this when the weather warms up and I feel like playing in the water.
there are so many good fishing kayaks on the market today - you really have a bunch of good choices
You should definitely let us know how easy/difficult it is to right your capsized PA. BTW. I haven't seen any reviews or feedback of PA users experience in the Ocean.
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no experience on an Outback - but many here have given good advice on that.
I've had my PA14 for a few months now, only had it on freshwater so far, 5 lakes of various size, various wind, and various waves/wakes. I've been really happy with it so far. it is heavy, but I'm able to get it on and off the top of my car without any issues - so it is not a problem for me. I've had various canoes and kayaks for the past 20 years, and fished from them all - the PA is my favorite so far. Looking forward to getting out on the ocean.
someone mentioned issues with righting a capsized PA - I can see how this would be challenging, i'd approach it the same as I would a small sail boat, have a line tied to one of the H-rails (in place of the mast), throw it over the bottom, and climb on the other side while pulling on the rope - the whole thing should flip over at that point. I'll play around with this when the weather warms up and I feel like playing in the water.
there are so many good fishing kayaks on the market today - you really have a bunch of good choices
You should definitely let us know how easy/difficult it is to right your capsized PA. BTW. I haven't seen any reviews or feedback of PA users experience in the Ocean.
will do..but don't expect a YouTube...that would be too humbling!
I talked to a few PA12/14 users who've had good experiences on ocean before I purchased - the standard quote was 'super stable', I've been out there in Canoes and Kayaks before - from what I've experienced so far - I expect good results. The initial stability is lower than my sit inside Loon 16T, but the secondary stability seems to be similar.
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Check out this guy encountering a persistent shark while fishing. This is when you hope your kayak is super stable or a speargun:smt072
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UcLV2CWi8oI
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It all depends on how big you are. I'm 6'2'' 300lbs and the PA is better for me since i alone will max the weight capacity
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It all depends on how big you are. I'm 6'2'' 300lbs and the PA is better for me since i alone will max the weight capacity
+1 This should be at the top of the list when deciding on a kayak. :smt003
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Check out this guy encountering a persistent shark while fishing. This is when you hope your kayak is super stable or a speargun:smt072
Some of the comments on that video are pretty good, like this one:
Some dude on a boat 200 yards away: “that guy can’t kayak worth shit”
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Had an Outback, great yak. Sold it for more stability PA14, as in stand-up fly casting.
Really liking the PA14. Excellent yak except for one thing...it's a heavy tank of a craft.
That 40-lb weight difference to put on top SUV, unloaded w/chair, front box, gear out, is very noticeable compared to the Outback.
The 360 drive makes up for slower maneuverability, really an aid in fighting, landing a big powerful fish such as salmon, yellowtail, big hali.
Example: tired fish, ready for net or gaff, circles toward stern. Twist 360 lever, pedal, yak responds & turns instantly, and fish landing much easier!
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I 99% fish salt water usually once a week in a 2014 pa 14 .i installed a double gasket on the front hatch & sealec the rod holders . i have been in all kinds of ocean from flat to 9@10 .never been in an outback so i cant say much about it .the pa has lots of room , a great chair & is extremely stable .i have flipped it in practice & use a recovery rope tied to a side handle to flipback over .i prefer the bigger boat because i fish 80% of the time alone .some day i will have a buddy seat on it for my son & that was also a reason i wanted the extra capacity .best of luck either way you pick .both are game changing vessels .
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I have owned both. I had a 2019 pa14 and currently have a 2021 outback. Outback all the way especially for trolling. But that’s just my opinion and there are plenty of people here that are willing to give their experiences and opinions. It’s always good to ask to see what other think but the only option that really matters is yours! It’s your $$$ that’s buying it so you just need to make sure your happy with what ever kayak you end up buying. Test them both out, look at what options they both offer or are lacking and then make your decision based off that.
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it's like religion or partners, there is no one right answer for everyone.
I honestly don't think you can make a bad decision in the Hobie line. I've fished with guys on all the variations, and they all 'love their boats'
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Outback hands down!! I have been in both
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Outback is too heavy as it is for surf launched trips. I couldn't imagine lugging around a PA.
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I own a 13' Revolution and a 12' Pro Angler 360. I got the PA 360 because I do a lot of jigging. I'm pretty skillful at staying stationary over the bottom in my Revolution, but as I expected, the 360 drive is terrific for the maneuvering required to stay stationary over the bottom in wind and waves. If you do a lot of jigging or other tight maneuvering, there are huge advantages to the 360 drive. However, that capability is the only thing I like about my Pro Angler. Here's a partial list of things which I dislike about the Pro Angler:
1. It's heavy and a beast to move around, to get on top of a vehicle, and to launch at unimproved launch sites. I can't pick it up and move it more than a couple of feet by myself - anything other than minor repositioning has to be done on a cart.
2. It's slow, especially in headwinds and in waves. In completely calm conditions and for short periods of time I can get it up to half a mile an hour slower than I routinely travel in my Revolution, but if there is any wind or waves, I'm usually moving at about 1.5 mph slower than I would be traveling in my Revolution. If I want to troll, I use my Revolution. At the end of a day in my Pro Angler, I'm more tired than I am after a day in my Revolution.
3. The H rails make it a lot harder to get in and out of the kayak. This is particularly a problem when I'm landing in waves which are crashing on shore, and climbing out of the kayak over the H-Rails while holding a paddle is real awkward. I prefer gear tracks to the H rails.
4. It's a beast to paddle when you need to paddle, as the steering mechanisms next to the seat and anything you have mounted on the H-rails, such as a fish finder and a rod holder, interfere with paddling. And the high seat and H-Rails mean that you need to use a long and awkward paddle to paddle a Pro Angler. It's bad enough when you need to paddle a short distance away from or back to shore, but paddling longer distances is a awkward and a lot of work. A month or so ago the belt on my 360 drive mechanism broke, freezing my drive when it was sitting at right angles to the keel. I was about 1.5 miles from my launch site. I took my fish finder and rod holder off the H-rails and paddled back to my launch site. It was a lot of work. By comparison, my Revolution is a pleasure to paddle. I've paddled it on four day and five day unsupported kayak trips on the John Day River in Oregon, with a plug in the drive hole. My Revolution paddles better than my 13' Ocean Kayak Trident. I'm an experienced whitewater kayaker, but I would not feel comfortable paddling my Pro Angler in or out through surf.
5. The paddle required to paddle a Pro Angler is too long to mount on a paddle holder on the side of the kayak, so after you paddle away from shore you have to break it in half and store the halves on clips on the rear half of the kayak, and before you land you need to re-assemble the paddle. This is a pain in the butt. And if one of the paddle halves got knocked out of its clip, it would sink.
6. Only Hobie makes accessories which mount on the H-Rails, and those attachments are expensive. For example, a tackle bin which mounts on the H-Rails costs $55. You can mount a base from any manufacturer on a Hobie H-Rail mounting plate, but you have to buy the mounting plate for $25 to do it. Rather than buy the Hobie gear bin, I bought two "Mainstays" ice bins from Walmart for $2.00 each and clip them to the H-Rails next to my seat, where they fit perfectly.
7. When paddling my Revolution in large and breaking waves, I can brace and set the kayak on its edge like a whitewater kayak. You can't do that in a Pro Angler. Paddling a Pro Angler is sort of like paddling a section of a floating dock. It's comfortable to sit on the dock in a lawn chair in moderate waves, but if the waves get too big, the section of dock is going to flip over, and there isn't much you can to to prevent it from happening.
On the positive side, the Pro Angler is a nicely designed kayak with a comfortable seat and many thoughtfully designed features, and there are kayaks produced by other manufacturers which are heavier than the Pro Angler. There are no doubt people without much kayaking experience who feel safer and more comfortable in a big kayak like a Pro Angler, but I prefer a kayak-sized kayak to the Pro Angler and other mini-bass-boat kayaks.
I wish that Hobie would produce an Outback with a 360 drive. If they do that, I'll buy one instantly and sell my Pro Angler. I don't know why Hobie couldn't produce an Outback with a 360 drive - the Outback is only two inches narrower than a 12' Pro Angler.
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Great write-up on the pros and cons of a PA! Should be it's own post!
I can't decide on whether to get the Outback or the PA. The cost doesn't really matter much and the weight difference isn't an issue. But which is better for the Bay Area and Ocean for fishing? Any PA or Outback fishermen, please share your thoughts. Thanks
I would say simply put if you are looking to go into the ocean and bay where the wind and swell are going to be in play, the OB is the better choice. However if you were planning on freshwater fishing and still weight isn't an issue, the PA would be hella fun. But all that it can do, the OB can do too, but lighter and a bit more nimble.