Can I test kayak fishing with my whitewater kayak inside the SF bay?

I am very curious about kayak fishing.  Since I already have a whitewater kayak, I'd like to give it a try with that.

I will be fishing at Alameda rockwall, the fishing ground is only about 100 yards from launch dock.  Do you think I'll be OK?  Is there any potential problem?

The potential problems are far too numerous to list in one post The Rockwall can have some mean tidal swings and the water is still pretty cold. Maybe try a lake first? Del-Valle might be a good place to go first time.

It doesn't seem like hanging out on a whitewater kayak will be very similar to the fishing that we're doing - stability, room to work, ease of movement on the water, ease of movement on the boat...  If you are curious about kayak fishing I'd demo a boat meant for it first.

Good luck - have fun!  Don't forget to report and try to get some pics.   

It doesn't seem like hanging out on a whitewater kayak will be very similar to the fishing that we're doing - stability, room to work, ease of movement on the water, ease of movement on the boat...  If you are curious about kayak fishing I'd demo a boat meant for it first.

Good luck - have fun!  Don't forget to report and try to get some pics.   

hehe maybe someone else will do the reporting 

I will only pick a day when water surface is flat like a mirror to go out.  But one concern I do share is the stability issue.  There have been times when I hook a halibut or a 70 lb bat ray, and had to pull with all the force I have.  Should the line breaks I'm not sure if the kayak will roll over.  Do you think a Hawaiian "side car" attachment will help?  Maybe on both sides?

Where does the hali go if you land it on the whitewater kayak?  Where's your net go?  Rod?  Tackle?

And...  flat like a mirror can turn into windy and choppy as hell in like 30 seconds!

I don't know that anyone's going to encourage you to attach anything to your whitewater kayak to make it a fishing kayak, but I could be wrong!

I've got a basic SOT fishing kayak you can borrow!   

There have been times when I hook a halibut or a 70 lb bat ray, and had to pull with all the force I have.  Should the line breaks I'm not sure if the kayak will roll over.

For real, if you hook anything of any size on the bay you're gonna be toast. Sounds like a disaster waiting to happen. Take Ab's offer up and try out his SOT.

Z

Bluestar here are a couple of photos of last Wednesday on SF-Bay by Berkley, first one was taken at about 8:30 or so and the other was about 10:00 am hope they help .

Pat R   

My friend and fishing buddy, Allen, is a whitewater kayaker and he never uses an SOT when fishing, just his old Dancer.  We fish all the wash rocks up here around Mendocino and he never seems to have any trouble.  Plenty of folks fish off old whitewater boats and true sea kayaks.  The trick is to have flotation, a good pump, a roll and a self rescue.  If you are a reasonable whitewater boater, you already have this stuff.

Allen has criss-cross bunchie setup in front of the cockpit where he stores his gear and pole.

I say go for it.

I'd watch the currents more than anything. It would very much suck to be in a boat that was good for only 3 mph, and have to fight a 2.95 mph current for an hour to get from your fishing spot to the launch. As to the wind waves, if you have the WW skills to go with the boat, then the wind waves shouldn't be too much of an issue. Pat R's picture is a pretty good example of the ankle biters you'll have to deal with. Not much compared to 6 foot standing waves, and hydraulics that can flip a 14' raft. Again, assuming you have the skills, staying upright isn't the issue, it's can you make way against the conditions?

In my mind, the issue is logistical:How do you deal with catch? Rods? Net? etc... As Bill mentioned, maybe give your boat a try on freshwater before hitting the bay, so you can see where the weaknesses really are. Also, you didn't mention what kind of WW boat. Ancient displacement hull? Playboat? Creeker?  For what it's worth, I fished from my SIK sea kayak on the ocean a good number of times, and found it completely doable. It's just a pain in the butt compared to fishing from a SOT. I could maybe see fishing a river in my WW boat, but only in some very specialized scenarios.

Scott

Dear Whitewater Boater.......

These guys don't know, from whitewater boats & fishing.

The answer is emphatically YES.
Whitewater boats....are swell for fishing.

I know what I'm talking about, I've been a whitewater boater since 1972.

I PREFER to fish out of my 14-foot Dagger Vesper.....but I also fish an awful lot out of my 8-foot Dagger GRADIENT.

Yes, it's true, that if you have a little "squirt" boat or a "play" boat....you've got a pretty slow boat under you.....and its DEFINITELY a fair thing to say:   That if you are going to fish in a ww boat you really must have a roll------principally because all fishermen fish an awful lot solo, and in the ocean often as much a 2-miles out.   In my 36 years of ocean fishing experience in a decked boat, Murphy's Rule rules:   If a thing can happen, it will.    And so you CAN plan on an 'open cockpit' capsize (which will happen faster than you can say 911....while you have your skirt off to a:) access fresh bait to re-bait your hook, or b:) while you bring a fish aboard, or C: FOR SOME DAMNED REASON THAT NO ONE COULD FORSEE.    And there you will be, upside down.  You will have to FIND your paddle and FIND the "roll orientaton" and snap your boat up, and re-apply your skirt.   The first question you will then address:  Is whether you have enough "free-board" to make an attempt to spongue or pump your boat dry.

SOT-boaters indulge in fancy rod holders the CAN be applied to a decked kayak but in my experienced opinion they are too bulky, they are too heavy,

What you do------is visit your ACE hardware and for $8-12.00 you pick up a "Flagpole Holder."    You buy a rod that fits the hole in the flagpole holder (or you shave a rod-butt down).     If you are going to mount your holder FORWARD.....PAY ATTENTION.....Mounting Point has to be about as far forward as you can conveniently reach and the angle has to be out-from-the-bow about 45-degrees....make sure before drilling holes and locking stuff in concrete, that as you lean forward a bit and put in a strong draw-stroke with your paddle, that your Damned Rod..!!!...doesn't get in the way.   And with such minor little considerations carefully addressed you are TOTALLY in business.

I fish Whitewater streams, from my whitewater boat.....ducking into midstream rock eddys.....but it's tricky.....you've got to provide for some way to "anchor" yourself in that boil.   I don't do it alot.   But it makes you smile with self-pleasure when you pull it off.

In Transit---on a lake or the Ocean, you travel with the rod holder depressed (rod horizontal to the water) so that ...........well heck......you can figure that one out....

If you fish the ocean you MUST bring along a dry-bag to CONTAIN your rock-fish..........because.........Rock Fish die with their sharp fins erect and if you come back through a heavy surf with a boat-load of rock-fish they are going to poke some really ugly holes in your thighs and legs and you will reach the sand with as much of your blood floating in the bilge-water as fish-blood...and you WILL have to go to the doctor because every one of those "pokes" is going to become a sesspool of infection.    But containing yer fish in a dry-bag will fix that.

So....fishing alone out there off an isolated coast....just remember that Murphy is with you every minute.   If it can happen, it will happen.   

See........it's so unexpected......       I was trolling 80-pound line to a 2-pound cannon-ball weight.....and then 6-feet of 60-pound Monofiliment....and then 30-inches to the hook with 15-pound mono.........in an area that was not deeper than 25 feet with MAJOR rock formations.     At first I was certain I "had a big one on...".......because I got that really sweet Jig Jig Jig feeling ....and leaving the rod in the holder......I leaned forward and gave the reel a few turns to tighten it up.....yes......

And then holy shit......the nose of the boat dived straight down, my boat went to vertical.....the ocean came up over the sprayskirt......came up....my face and tummy were submerged.......and the boat gave a savage corkscrewing motion......and I was fully upside-down....holding my paddle with one hand....and I felt....and yes, underwater, I heard something go BANG.....and the boat was surging toward the surface but still upside down.   I came to the e-roll position, found correct blade orientation, snapped in a roll and I was back up in the air and the blue sky.    Floating like a cork...everything peachy....but I could see that my rod-holder was broken away and my rod & reel were gone.

What had happened was.......that while my boat was in the bottom of a swell with my line all snugged tight..... that 2-pound lead cannon-ball weight jamed in the rocks.   OK....the 8-foot surge reaches my boat....and what happened after that makes perfectly good physical sense.

Oh......one more thing.........in another post you received a caution....that your boat will only make 3 mph and it would be no fun to be bucking a 2.9-mph tide.   This is absolutely true but I cannot help but want to add a little perspective.   SOTs generally won't go over 3 mph any better than your whitewater boat.   You wanna KNOW two things about ANY boat:    A) what is my "sustained speed paddling rate"???     and B)   what is my 1/2-mile max output, speed????    The only way you can KNOW these numbers is to take your GPS and put it in the "velocity" mode.    Then you paddle for both conditions.....and you will generate those two Very Important numbers, and they will be true FOR YOU...in YOUR BOAT.     

Well, that's enuff.
Go have a good time.

By the way........whitewater boats are REALLY GOOD platforms for duck hunting.
But that's another whole thing.

Judd

I have to agree with Most of the other posters, try it on fresh First.  JW makes some interesting Points,  but a few Questions I have are what does the bottom of your boat look Like? round and smooth? is there A skeg?  how long is it? have you ever paddled your boat on flat water?  The last time I tried to paddle a ww boat on the lake I had all sorts of trouble tracking straight and the boat was very tippy IMHO. some one please correct me if i'm wrong,  but a ww boat is designed to be propelled by the fast moving river, stream Etc... and the paddle is used for steering, staying upright and short bursts of power, where as ocean Sot's are designed to be propelled mainly by Paddling, and with the hull designs will track straight. I'm sure experienced ww paddlers could possibly make up for the hull design with a even paddle stroke to keep it straight.  I also have to agree that most of the other issues would be logistical as Scott mentioned, MHO: try it with the ww boat, and then try a SOT and see which you like better,  I feel you will find for Fishing a Sot is the better Tool, Not to say you can't fish from your ww boat, but you might have a better overall experience with the SOT.  Just my 2 cents, take it for what it's worth from a non ww boater.

I don't know, Judd. Your story just confirms my belief that a whitewater boat is inherently more dangerous than a SOT when fishing in the ocean. Just because you CAN do it doesn't mean that you SHOULD do it.

Can I test kayak fishing with my whitewater kayak inside the SF bay?

You haven't indicated that you have a solid roll and self rescue abilities (do you?)...

My 2 cents... if you have to ask that question, then you either question your WW skills, and/or you don't have the background to make an informed decision wrt the above question.  Want to temp fate and possibly be a statistic?  Go for it. 

Want to use common sense and play it safe?  Then try it on flat water first, and also try what many other kayak fisherpeople use, a SOT, so that you can compare and contrast the advantages and disadvantages, most of which deal with safety and fishability.

I'm a novice sot kayak fisherman, and an intermediate ww kayaker, and the couple times I tries using a sik for fishing, while it was fun, it was also a huge pain in the ass.  After I had a sot I have never once thought again to use the sik for fishing... night and day, to me at least.

The good thing though is that you are asking the question... lots of great advice here, both against, and for (provided some caveats are met in the affirmative).

Good luck!  Backcountry

See........it's so unexpected......       I was trolling 80-pound line to a 2-pound cannon-ball weight.....and then 6-feet of 60-pound Monofiliment....and then 30-inches to the hook with 15-pound mono.........in an area that was not deeper than 25 feet with MAJOR rock formations.     At first I was certain I "had a big one on...".......because I got that really sweet Jig Jig Jig feeling ....and leaving the rod in the holder......I leaned forward and gave the reel a few turns to tighten it up.....yes......

That's sounds pretty foolish why would you need 80lb with a 15lb leader and 2lbs of lead in 25 FOW you were just asking for trouble.
How could you expect to land anything with the leader longer than your boat? I don't think I would ever use anything heaver than 30lb in my yak. I hope your use a little more sense kayaking than you do fishing.

I'm not going to be too heavy handed with advice here. I've tinkered with fishing the salt in my Dancer sit inside whitewater boat. I did that because I didn't know any better, and sometimes you just experiment with what you have. I rigged a small flotation device (a little plastic bottle) to my rod and reel, so I could toss it in a hurry and grab my paddle for a roll. I never had to. I caught a few fish, and never felt that it was too sketchy.

Having said that, it's the wrong tool for the job. SOT boats offer us so much more storage options and flexilbility to rig for fishing than SIKs, and they're easy to find...or borrow. Hell, I'll loan you a Scrambler any time.

That being said, go ahead and play with your whitewater boat, but stick to protected water in safe conditions, with a buddy or two to watch over you, and have a plan to cover the worst case scenario.

Good luck.