New School Part Deux: Li-on batteries

I've submitted this in more detail to Bill as an article but it may take him a while to publish it, so I thought I provide a brief on my foray into Li-on power for my T15. For me, it is a breakthrough technology.

It's pricey at $99.99 for a 4400 mAh cell--but that cell powered the Humminbird 580 Sounder/GPS in my T15 for 10 1/2 hours and was still at 13.8 V. At 13 ounces and the size of 10 AAs, that's a breakthrough like fuel cells are for unmanned space flight. My 4000 mAh Gel Cell weighs 3 1/2 pounds and is far larger. The intelligent charger is great too--it runs on a 12 volt source meaning I can use an AC converter, my car, or take a 12V 12 AH gel cell camping and get at least 2 full charges from it. The 4400 mAh 14.8 V array charges in about 4-5 hours. The charger runs $26.99.

The small size and lightness opens up new mounting places and one I am considering is show below. It is between the flush Scotty mounts just forward of the rod pod in my T15. I am imagining shaping and bending a flat piece of plastic to slide over the threads and lock in place that has the battery box mounted to it keeping it high, dry, and out of the way inside the hull--yet easy to access. Given all the clever and resourceful innovators on this board, I cannot wait to see where some of you take it from here.

Here are some pics...

Nice set up.  Thank you for the pictures and information.

Sweet!  We'll have to hook up myself up with a Li-ion Battery.  Not much of a tech person but could sure use some help in getting the charging system wire setup you've got there.  Thanks!     

Not much of a tech person but could sure use some help in getting the charging system wire setup you've got there.  

I have a few unnecessary connectors in there as I was reluctant to cut wires on the stock charger until I tested things a bit.
Perhaps I should add some more technical detail to the article and use an off-the-shelf AC converter you can buy at RadioShack or something so I can give fail-proof instructions for people that don't have multimeters or other tech gear to measure voltage polarity. I could help you do the power set up as well--it's pretty simple and fast if one has the connectors and tools.

Bill has also talked about "New School Part Deux--the movie" which would of course star Charlie Sheen and Leslie Nielsen  

Nicely done SM. Thanks for sharing.

Jedmo

Supa slick!

The other cool part about these is the number of charging cycles those batteries will take. About 10x the life of your old AGM.  Sweet setup.

Am I correct in thinking this particular battery pack is Li-ion (http://www.all-battery.com/li-ion18650148v4400mahpcbpreotectedrechargeablebatterywith2-holeconnector.aspx), instead of the LiFePO4 (http://www.batteryspace.com/lifepo418650battery128v4050mah5184wh7aratewpcb.aspx) that was in fishshim's article?

Is there a performance/safety tradeoff for between Li-ion and LiFePO4?

From the AllBattery website re Li-ion:

    *   The batteries, packs, and chargers you are purchasing are for professional use only
    * You are supposed to have sufficient knowledge in handling the products.
    * You will only charging the batteries and packs in a fire proofing container. You will not leave the product on the wood materials or carpet environment that would promote fire spread.
    * You will not put / use products in place adjacent flammable materials and you will take caution and wear protective cloths, glass and gloves.
    * You will not leave the batteries, packs and chargers unattended during charging and using
    * When you want to use Li-ion battery to make packs, Protective Circuit Board (PCB) is required.
    * Any modifications of battery, packs and chargers void the warranty.
    * If you make battery packs using the single Li-ion or Li-polymer cells and / PCB from us, we are not responsible for the final battery pack performance and liability as the workmanship and assembly details could lead to defects.
    * All-Battery.com (Tenergy Corporation) is NOT responsible for any damages and consequences caused by misusing


and then this comment for the LiFe's:


LiFe Rechargeable Battery
Why LiFe Battery?

    * High Performance —High theoretical capacity of 170mah/g and high practical capacity as high as 165mah/g.
    * Extremely Safe/Stable Chemistry —High intrinsic safety , no explosion & will not catch fire under collision, over charged or short circuit. High thermal stability of phases up to 500C.
    * High Rate Capability —For all high power output application
    * Extraordinary Long Cycle Life -Best can up to 2000 cycle life, would be over 8 times life of Lead Acid and 3-4 times of Li-ion.
    * Long Service Life —Around 5~6 years
    * Environmentally Friendly Non-toxic, non-contaminating and No rare metal
    * Wide working temperature range —From -4 F to 150 F (-20 C–+70C) Extremely cold and extremely hot weather will not effect its performance
    * Flexible Form Factor —Small in size and light in weight 1/3 weight of Lead Acid and 65% weight of NIMH.
    * No memory effect
    * Fast Charge —Can be fully charged in a very short time ---2C fast charge within half hour


Not trying to pass judgements, just trying to understand what to upgrade to...

mikechin

I do believe that lithium iron phosphate (LiFePO4) is safer than lithium ion cells.  It's one of the reasons that most of the current lithium battery technologies for electric cars are variations on the lithium iron phosphate theme.  The Because I was purchasing a 20 AH pack I was particularly concerned about the safety issues.  I had visions of my orange Prowler glowing ever brighter, like a bright orange jack-o-lantern, just before my hull melted and I headed for the bottom.

The pack I am using has the Protective Circuitry (PCB) integrated into it which prevents the internal shorting problems. In addition, the batteries are of good manufacturing quality. The famous fires caused by a tiny fraction of Li-on batteries were due to low quality manufacturing (cutting corners by competitive vendors in the PC industry) which allowed some cells to suffer from a gradual accumulation of metal inside the cells causing a short circuit. Tenergy uses high quality cells and integrates PCB into the device to prevent this problem--the cells cost more but I view it as essential to have that circuitry. Notice they require tha circuitry--I would not use Li-on without it.

When Li-po (LiFePO4) batteries come in the right sizes and for the right price (the equivalent is $300 or so), 'll use them because they have even better characteristics. I chose a high quality pack with built-in safeguards and I personally think there is greater risk of a GWS attack or a boomer tipping the boat than having my Li-on meltdown on the water. But that's an individual decision and I cannot speak for anyone else's evaluation of risk. I can only show you what I am doing and tell you why.

Pretty nice and pimpin' there SM. Running 10+ hours w/ still 13V left @ 13 ounces sound like a dream. I think I might know what I want to ask santa for.

Z