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2017 AOTY/DOTY Entry

Topic: Sheep, Copper, and Verm - Epic Day!  (Read 582 times)

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dirkbeachman

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I just had a brilliant idea- add mola mola to the doty list and you'll crush it!!
(Just have to find someone to eat it!!)


mtitch12

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I just had a brilliant idea- add mola mola to the doty list and you'll crush it!!
(Just have to find someone to eat it!!)

Haha I don’t think I could bring myself to shoot one of those  :smt005
Matt Titchenal
Hometown: Sonoma, CA
Grad Student
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCAAsGhHsSd5U0eDCUaoUpqQ?view_as=subscriber


ryang85

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I just had a brilliant idea- add mola mola to the doty list and you'll crush it!!
(Just have to find someone to eat it!!)

Haha I donďż˝t think I could bring myself to shoot one of those  :smt005
I would have had a 100 pounder hanging off my kayak if was on the DOTY list, hahaha it was difficult for me to shoot a greenling and a perch let a alone a mola, they all taste like garbage compared to a fat ling or big scallop.
  The 15 specie thing is still hard for me to get, the 4 hour drive south vs the 40 minute drive  north  makes me really unmotivated to go south and basically only  have the chance to find a sheep.  Gas isnt very cheep for my pickup.


BigJim

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I just had a brilliant idea- add mola mola to the doty list and you'll crush it!!
(Just have to find someone to eat it!!)

Haha I donďż˝t think I could bring myself to shoot one of those  :smt005
I would have had a 100 pounder hanging off my kayak if was on the DOTY list, hahaha it was difficult for me to shoot a greenling and a perch let a alone a mola, they all taste like garbage compared to a fat ling or big scallop.
  The 15 specie thing is still hard for me to get, the 4 hour drive south vs the 40 minute drive  north  makes me really unmotivated to go south and basically only  have the chance to find a sheep.  Gas isnt very cheep for my pickup. [/img]

I don't get why you think you need to drive south for a sheep...I bet you could have shot a butt and striper up there this summer if you put in the time...

Ling, Cab, Ab, Scallop, Black, Blue, Olive, Grassy, Kelpy, Copper, Monkey, Butt, Striper, Verm, Perch....use the perch for crab bait if you don't like eating them.

But, guys who live south of the GG drive up North to get abs...so...yeah.

Whatever, I'll let whoever takes over DOTY do whatever they want with the rules next year and into the future.

 :smt006

Sincerely,

Jim
« Last Edit: December 06, 2017, 10:30:16 AM by BigJim »

~GS 4  2010-1st~DOTY 2012-5th~DOTY 2013-1st~DOTY 2014-5th~T2B2 2015-1st~DOTY 2015-4th~DOTY 2016-7th~


mtitch12

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  The 15 specie thing is still hard for me to get, the 4 hour drive south vs the 40 minute drive  north  makes me really unmotivated to go south and basically only  have the chance to find a sheep.  Gas isnt very cheep for my pickup.
I don't get why you think you need to drive south for a sheep...I bet you could have shot a butt and striper up there this summer if you put in the time...
Ling, Cab, Ab, Scallop, Black, Blue, Olive, Grassy, Kelpy, Copper, Monkey, Butt, Striper, Verm, Perch....use the perch for crab bait if you don't like eating them.
But, guys who live south of the GG drive up North to get abs...so...yeah.
Whatever, I'll let whoever takes over DOTY do whatever they want with the rules next year and into the future.

@BigJim You forgot about Gopher/B&Y/China in your list for fish to shoot up north. So really only necessary for Sonoma/Mendo divers to get EITHER a butt or a striper if the drive to Monterey is too far/too expensive.

@ryang85 I really think the geographic limitations go both ways. Based on my limited experience, I've noticed the following:
The only two species that are definitely limited geographically between Monterey and Sonoma/Mendo (in my experience) are sheephead and abalone. Sheephead are more common in Monterey, even though they are not common by any means, and are rare north of there. To balance this out, abs are only available to the north. 

Then there are some species that are more common/easier to get depending on where you are:
Olives are available in Monterey and Sonoma but easier to get in Monterey. But again, to even that out, scallops in my experience are much easier to find in Mendocino/Sonoma than Monterey. I've limited on scallops in Mendo but never found more than one on a given Monterey dive. Also black rockfish and greenling are more common/bigger up north in my experience.

So basically, there are advantages to living in both areas. If the ab fishery gets closed next year, things may need to be reevaluated/tweaked, but hopefully that doesn't happen.

Matt Titchenal
Hometown: Sonoma, CA
Grad Student
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCAAsGhHsSd5U0eDCUaoUpqQ?view_as=subscriber


BigJim

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All great points Matt!

Yep, forgot the gophers/chinas!  :smt002

I've shot 4 butts south of the GG and 3 north of the GG since 2013, my 3 biggest so far are the ones I got up North...and I know guys that have shot Stripers and WSB north of the GG...

Anyway, there are plenty of comps that you can do in one day and that just require you to dive in one spot...DOTY is not set up to be one of those.

 :smt001

 :smt006

Sincerely,

Jim

~GS 4  2010-1st~DOTY 2012-5th~DOTY 2013-1st~DOTY 2014-5th~T2B2 2015-1st~DOTY 2015-4th~DOTY 2016-7th~


BigJim

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Sorry to jack your thread so much Matt...hope you don't mind this discussion on here.  :smt008

Here's some more background of the 15 versus all species counting change that we put into effect this year...all species counting was even harder for guys that didn't want to drive south of the GG...

Here's the thread and I pulled out the pertinent part:

http://www.norcalkayakanglers.com/index.php?topic=75105.0

Quote
4. We want to mix it up a little for 2017.

Despite my stubbornness and desire to keep the game the same, we do think some changes will be good for DOTY and for the majority of people playing the game...

Over the years we have received all kinds of feedback from people...some of the feedback has been incorporated into DOTY and some has not...

We (myself and whoever else has been on the DOTY committee at the time) have made a point to make sure that we do NOT make changes based on feedback from people who seem to want to change DOTY to make it into a game they think they could do better at, a game that would be "better" for how they like to dive, where they like to dive, and what kinds of fish they like to target...

However, we get it that some people don't want to harvest certain species for a variety of reasons...and we don't want DOTY (or my stubbornness to change DOTY) to be the only reason that a person (or group of people) kills certain kinds of fish...

So...with all of the above said, we WILL be making the following changes for 2017 DOTY:

A. We will be adding Striped Bass taken from the Ocean as a species.

It became legal to spear Stripers year round in the Ocean (and in certain FW areas in certain months) in 2013.

Shooting Stripers in Freshwater has been VERY controversial, and while (as long as the various rules and regs are followed) it is totally legal we do not think DOTY should add them as a species while their take is so controversial.

Stripers from the Ocean are a much different story, and my first hand experience with surf casters and other angler groups (I have even been participating on the www.StripersOnline.com forum) has been overwhelmingly positive.

These are beautiful, delicious fish and can be taken by any diver willing to put in the time in the surf, and I have seen reports and pics of them being taken from SLO all the way up into Humboldt.

We are not 100% sure on the Points Per Inch (PPI) yet but will get it ironed out before the start of 2017.

AOTY has Stripers at 5.5 PPI, so the three below would be 236.5, 235.125 and 184.25...

http://doty.norcalkayakanglers.com/catches/2310

http://doty.norcalkayakanglers.com/catches/2316

http://doty.norcalkayakanglers.com/catches/2317

These other ~24/25 inch fish would be worth about 132/137.5 points which seems about right for their modest size:

http://doty.norcalkayakanglers.com/catches/2259

http://doty.norcalkayakanglers.com/catches/2318

http://doty.norcalkayakanglers.com/catches/2338

We are looking forward to seeing future DOTY divers get involved in this fishery if they choose to.  :smt001

B. We will be making DOTY a best of FIFTEEN species comp.

As stated above, some divers don't like shooting some types of fish for any number of reasons (they don't like eating that fish, they don't like taking that species of fish for moral/ethical reasons etc).

For the past 5 years all of the species in DOTY have counted towards a diver's total points, so it has kinda been like Pokémon...gotta get em all!  :smt002 :smt005

While the Pokémon style has forced divers to dive up and down the coast, in various depths and areas etc it has had the effect of forcing anyone who wanted to be a serious DOTY competitor to take at least one of ALL possible species regardless of its size or if the diver really wanted to kill it.

However, we have resisted going to just having the top ten species count (like AOTY) because then it would potentially be possible for a diver to just harvest 10 relatively easily found species and place/win without pushing themselves to find and take some of the more "elusive species"...

For example, in 2012 fuzz took 12 species in a day out of SWS...one day of diving should not be all it takes to win a year long comp like DOTY:

http://doty.norcalkayakanglers.com/catches/84

With the addition of Striped Bass from the Ocean, there will now be 19 total possible DOTY species...by having the top 15 species count a diver who does not want to shoot a certain species (for whatever reason) will not have to, and will have the flexibility to shoot species they actually want to kill, BUT will still have to push themselves to dive different areas and explore to get 15 species.

Here are some possible combinations that we can think of with the new top 15 rule:

Shallow (less than 30 feet) Combo:
1. Cab
2. Greenling
3. Ling
4. Perch
5. Monkey
6. Olive
7. Grassy
8. Kelpy
9. Blue
10. Black
11. BNY
12. Ab
13. Scallop
14. Copper
15. Sheep/Butt/Striper Wildcard

NorCal (North of GG Bridge) Combo:
1. Verm
2. Cab
3. Greenling
4. Ling
5. Perch
6. Olive
7. Grassy
8. Kelpy
9. Blue
10. Black
11. BNY
12. Ab
13. Scallop
14. Butt
15. Copper/Monkey/Striper/WSB Wildcard

Elitist (No "trash fish") combo:
1. Verm
2. Cab
3. Ling
4. Butt
5. Olive
6. Grassy
7. Blue
8. Black
9. Copper
10. China
11. Ab
12. Scallop
13. Sheep
14. WSB
15. Striper

CenCal (south of GG Bridge) Combo:
1. Verm
2. Cab
3. Ling
4. Perch
5. Butt
6. Monkey
7. Sheep
8. Olive
9. Grassy
10. Kelpy
11. Blue
12. Black
13. Copper
14. BNY
15. Striper

Obviously there are a lot of different combo possibilities, and our hope is that divers will still be able to be competitive in DOTY, without having to kill species they are opposed to taking, but will still be required to push themselves to explore and dive outside of their personal comfort zone to take 15 species that are big enough to be competitive.

~GS 4  2010-1st~DOTY 2012-5th~DOTY 2013-1st~DOTY 2014-5th~T2B2 2015-1st~DOTY 2015-4th~DOTY 2016-7th~


ryang85

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  The 15 specie thing is still hard for me to get, the 4 hour drive south vs the 40 minute drive  north  makes me really unmotivated to go south and basically only  have the chance to find a sheep.  Gas isnt very cheep for my pickup.
I don't get why you think you need to drive south for a sheep...I bet you could have shot a butt and striper up there this summer if you put in the time...
Ling, Cab, Ab, Scallop, Black, Blue, Olive, Grassy, Kelpy, Copper, Monkey, Butt, Striper, Verm, Perch....use the perch for crab bait if you don't like eating them.
But, guys who live south of the GG drive up North to get abs...so...yeah.
Whatever, I'll let whoever takes over DOTY do whatever they want with the rules next year and into the future.

@BigJim You forgot about Gopher/B&Y/China in your list for fish to shoot up north. So really only necessary for Sonoma/Mendo divers to get EITHER a butt or a striper if the drive to Monterey is too far/too expensive.

@ryang85 I really think the geographic limitations go both ways. Based on my limited experience, I've noticed the following:
The only two species that are definitely limited geographically between Monterey and Sonoma/Mendo (in my experience) are sheephead and abalone. Sheephead are more common in Monterey, even though they are not common by any means, and are rare north of there. To balance this out, abs are only available to the north. 

Then there are some species that are more common/easier to get depending on where you are:
Olives are available in Monterey and Sonoma but easier to get in Monterey. But again, to even that out, scallops in my experience are much easier to find in Mendocino/Sonoma than Monterey. I've limited on scallops in Mendo but never found more than one on a given Monterey dive. Also black rockfish and greenling are more common/bigger up north in my experience.

So basically, there are advantages to living in both areas. If the ab fishery gets closed next year, things may need to be reevaluated/tweaked, but hopefully that doesn't happen.
The main issue is my halibut/striper/wsb spots are too far for my to paddle a kayak especially in a current. And i struck out on the bar this year for flatties so i need a sheep ( i also want to shoot one since ive never seen one before).

  I understand the need for the compition to be challenging, im pretty comfortable in marin,sonoma and mendo with big scallops, abs,blacks and lings,  but ive gone down to Monterey mulitple times and strugled terribly. Diving different spots and found nothing at all. As someome who primarily shoots fish for meat, its always been difficult for me to head south when i know i can pile  up all  fish i want to eat for the week without the travel. But if we reduced the species it would be only based on basicaly size and that gives the compition a different mind set than the idea of having a variety.  I think 15 species is perfect,  i just am super picky with what i eat so i except shooting a 150 point perch and greenling and search for a big ling or scallops. 
 I just need to get some motivation to head south and shoot a sheep and copper. Im 3 fish away and there are lots of  16 to 17 " olives up here i just need to shoot one and stop looking for a trophy.