Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
September 22, 2018, 03:35:05 PM

Login with username, password and session length

Recent Topics

[Today at 01:18:29 PM]

[Today at 11:48:38 AM]

[Today at 09:53:37 AM]

[Today at 09:27:45 AM]

[Today at 09:16:42 AM]

[Today at 09:02:48 AM]

[Today at 07:53:50 AM]

[September 21, 2018, 11:14:44 PM]

[September 21, 2018, 11:11:57 PM]

[September 21, 2018, 09:57:33 PM]

[September 21, 2018, 08:39:24 PM]

[September 21, 2018, 06:40:12 PM]

[September 21, 2018, 06:19:43 PM]

[September 21, 2018, 05:08:33 PM]

[September 21, 2018, 03:59:37 PM]

[September 21, 2018, 03:57:45 PM]

[September 21, 2018, 03:07:33 PM]

[September 21, 2018, 12:46:34 PM]

[September 21, 2018, 10:32:41 AM]

[September 21, 2018, 09:58:28 AM]

[September 21, 2018, 08:07:32 AM]

[September 21, 2018, 07:52:21 AM]

[September 21, 2018, 07:19:31 AM]

[September 20, 2018, 08:44:32 PM]

Support NCKA

Support the site by making a donation.

2018 AOTY/DOTY Entry

Topic: Hobie copy?  (Read 1934 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

bmb

  • Deputy, Integrated Community Communications (D.I.C.C)
  • AOTY Committee
  • *
  • View Profile
  • Location: Livermoron
  • Date Registered: Aug 2008
  • Posts: 7073
My point is the quality isn't going to be the same. The plastic used by Hobie, Wildy, Native, Ocean, or any other quality kayak builder is going to be much better than the plastic used by U-Boats knock offs made in China. The same goes for the pedal drive systems. Just look at the CEO vs BMW X5 or any other knock off product coming out of China.

I'm not standing on moral high ground, I'm looking at it from a ROI perspective. Sure you can buy a few knock offs for the same price as the Hobie, but at what actual cost. Are you going to trust a manufacture that steals designs, but doesn't meet the same quality standards with your life? What recourse will you have when the product fails on the ocean and someone dies? It took BMW 8 years and hundreds of millions to win its case to which China said "yeah you got us... So what".
You can't tell that by looking at a picture of it on the internet.  It may be true, or it may not be.  Plastic quality isn't a US monopoly.  At its core, its still just plastic.  Design matters, and components matter.  Most of these drive systems have parts that are sourced overseas.  It is very possible that these chinese manufacturers have access to the exact same parts and components as their US competitors.  After all, one of the most popular kayak companies these days is FeelFree, and their boats are decent quality, but could use some refinements to make things better.  But are they safe? Yes. 

I've been purchasing chinese (branded) stuff for years.  List of the chinese (branded) things I own:
baitcasting reels
fishing rods
gopro knockoff
robot vacuum
fishing lures - jerkbaits and jigs

All of these are as high quality as the US counterparts. They're not cheap or chintzy, they're smooth, refined and high quality. Some have improvements over the US counterpart.

These chinese knockoff kayaks, at least per the pictures, look pretty bad.  But that doesn't mean they can't make better ones with the same components.  Are they "good" enough?  I don't know.  But you can't just discount them.  I'm sure if I wanted to and had a bunch of money, that I could go to china, find all the components I need and a high quality industrial oven and go for it to make a good kayak.  It's not like kayaks are difficult to build* and that chinese employees can't be trained to build* them.
« Last Edit: September 19, 2017, 08:36:27 AM by bmb »


FeoPronk

  • Salmon
  • ***
  • View Profile
  • Location: Petaluma
  • Date Registered: Mar 2015
  • Posts: 126
My wife used to work in product development dealing with Chinese manufacturers. They will sell you whatever level of quality you are willing to pay for. If you want cheap crap, they can do that. If you are willing to pay for quality they can do that too.


  • Old school or no school.
  • View Profile
  • Location: OAK
  • Date Registered: Dec 2014
  • Posts: 766
14' Necky Dolphin, fast and wiggly, no room for anything.
Old Mitchell reel junkie.


The Inn Keeper (yakhopper)

  • Life is Good in the Cove!
  • Sea Lion
  • ****
  • View Profile The Tides Inn
  • Location: Shelter Cove, Ca.
  • Date Registered: Oct 2007
  • Posts: 4049
All this complaining about Chinese knock off and how they use cheap plastic, yet I see more RTIC coolers and cups everyday.
Are we really concerned about what the product may be, or just Hobie snobs?
I for one won't buy anything untill it proves it's self .... Even if it's American Made.

Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk

http:/www.sheltercovetidesinn.com
Hobie Revo-13 (Blue)
Ocean Kayak Trident-13 (Camo)


Mojo Jojo

  • Sea Lion
  • ****
  • View Profile
  • Location: Garibaldi Oregon
  • Date Registered: Apr 2016
  • Posts: 1009
 :happy1:

Im just here for the entertainment  :smt044


2013 Jackson Big Tuna.........Ours
2011 Native Mariner Propel 12.5...His
2015 Native Slayer Propel 13.......Hers
20?? Emotion ,Sparky.....5 yr old grandson's
Event Coordinator
Heroes On the Water
North Oregon Coast Chapter
Team C.O.D. FISHING (Crazy Old Dudes)just for forum fun challenges


Dannarchy

  • Salmon
  • ***
  • View Profile
  • Location: Santa Clara
  • Date Registered: Aug 2016
  • Posts: 353
All this complaining about Chinese knock off and how they use cheap plastic, yet I see more RTIC coolers and cups everyday.
Are we really concerned about what the product may be, or just Hobie snobs?
I for one won't buy anything untill it proves it's self .... Even if it's American Made.

Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk

I don't have or plan to have a Hobie so I'm clearly not a Hobie snob.

The last time I checked when a cup, camera, cooler, baitcast reel, pole, vacuum or lure failed; ppl didn't go into the water and have to be rescued or worse. Yes there are many fine products coming out of China (even knockoffs), but I am not trusting mine or anyone else's life with a knock off until its proven. When I see a knockoff that looks suspect at 1/5 the cost I tend to want it to be proven it works. yes that goes for GoPro knockoffs also.
WS Thresher 140
WS Radar 135 PD


Wildrooster

  • Salmon
  • ***
  • View Profile
  • Location: Valley springs
  • Date Registered: Oct 2015
  • Posts: 404
That's very interesting some of the very best Rc High performance gliders come from china
This reminds me of when everyone said Japan makes crap but as it turned out a lot for that crap was made to company standards for American companies
Japan also bought an a lot of the stuff back and reused the material
The nation set a higher standard for its self  and we no longer call things from Japan cheap junk
China definitely has the ability to make any standard of tools or parts
They are behind in car but won't be for long
That said some things in china are made for the company and a nite shift using the same materials and skills make the same product for sale elsewhere
On a side note almost all kayaks are made using the same plastic 
« Last Edit: September 21, 2017, 02:19:14 AM by Wildrooster »
glade you made it
now let's get our fish on

Ascend FS128T
Hobie AI yellow


Life_is_Yak

  • Sand Dab
  • **
  • View Profile
  • Location: Salinas, CA
  • Date Registered: Sep 2017
  • Posts: 69
I'd like to see one in person.  I have an outback and to be honest if I could have gotten a uboat for $550 I'd be stupid to not look at them and weigh the pros and cons.  Plastic is cheap and I'm not sure the different brands of HDLP plastic will make that much difference.  What will make a difference is how the plastic is molded.  If they do a good job of molding and keep uniform thickness I'd be down to try it.. 

This makes me wonder if hobies patent has expired.  Seems like its about time.

Hate to say it but its was bound to happen at some point.  Might see Uboats in walmart soon!  Probably for $1000 or less.
« Last Edit: September 21, 2017, 01:58:07 PM by Life_is_Yak »


  • Old school or no school.
  • View Profile
  • Location: OAK
  • Date Registered: Dec 2014
  • Posts: 766

This makes me wonder if hobies patient has expired.  Seems like its about time.


Patent? We don't need no stinkin' patents!
14' Necky Dolphin, fast and wiggly, no room for anything.
Old Mitchell reel junkie.


Ho Chi Min Oh

  • Sea Lion
  • ****
  • View Profile
  • Date Registered: Mar 2005
  • Posts: 5609
Quote
This makes me wonder if hobies patient has expired.  Seems like its about time.

Hobes has bunch of issued cases.  If you mean the mirage drive patent, priority date 2005, so still got some legz. 

Quote
Plastic is cheap and I'm not sure the different grades of plastic with make that much difference.  What will make a difference is how the plastic is molded.

the quality and type of plastic make a diff.  belee dat, bruh


bioman

  • Salmon
  • ***
  • View Profile
  • Location: Elk Grove, CA
  • Date Registered: Dec 2011
  • Posts: 302
Hey Dannarchy, with respect to using chinese boats to go in the water where you might die if the product failed....nearly all the inflatable sport boats (zodiac, west marine, solstice, aquos, Seago, Avon, Mercury, Walker, Aqua Dutch, Sea Eagle, many new brand names) are made in China now.....they can afford labor to do hand lay ups. 


Life_is_Yak

  • Sand Dab
  • **
  • View Profile
  • Location: Salinas, CA
  • Date Registered: Sep 2017
  • Posts: 69
Quote
This makes me wonder if hobies patient has expired.  Seems like its about time.

Hobes has bunch of issued cases.  If you mean the mirage drive patent, priority date 2005, so still got some legz. 

Quote
Plastic is cheap and I'm not sure the different grades of plastic with make that much difference.  What will make a difference is how the plastic is molded.

the quality and type of plastic make a diff.  belee dat, bruh
I probably should have been more specific.  If their using High Density Linear Polyethylene I don't think the difference in one brand of HDLP will make that much of a difference.  Some may be better than others but in general is pretty good stuff


B0B

  • Salmon
  • ***
  • Tapatalk User
  • View Profile
  • Location: San Jose, California
  • Date Registered: Nov 2014
  • Posts: 899
so is it a kayak or submarine?

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

-Bob


hightide

  • Sea Lion
  • ****
  • View Profile
  • Location: Benicia
  • Date Registered: Apr 2007
  • Posts: 3500
It might turn into Submarine if not up to specs :smt003
ALLAN

2015 Hobie AI
OK T15

Live, Love, Launch!


Ho Chi Min Oh

  • Sea Lion
  • ****
  • View Profile
  • Date Registered: Mar 2005
  • Posts: 5609
Quote
but in general is pretty good stuff

Genrully, shur, but sometimes no.  See this product recall where, against Bell Helmet spex, the asian mfr substituted an ITW Nexus buckle with a lesser quality plastic component.  Plastic ain't just plastic, not all HDLP da same, considering HDLP not single grade substance, i.e., even within "high density" the densities can verry.

not anti-china here, just rilly fuh millyer w issues 4 asian suppliers.  it qan git bad, even with branded goods.  Imagine QC/QA and customer service go off a davenport cliff wrt off-branded or non-branded, open mold stuff.  OTW is no thyme to discover your nu bote is water soluble = no chow fun at all. 


 

anything