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2018 AOTY/DOTY Entry

Topic: Kazkazi Dorado...first paddle  (Read 8906 times)

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polepole

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I'm with Mol on this one.

PROS
Great hull.
Fast Boat.
Nice stability.  No really defined primary and secondary stability, nice and smooth across the range.

CONS
The cockpit and storage are not to my tastes.
I too had the pinching calves problem.
The seat hurt my back.  The seat is very low in the yak (which is great for stability) but the seat back area is at an odd angle for me.
The cutouts along the rail on either side of seat area let water in when I was rocking back and forth and I wasn't rocking that hard.
Rear tank well is shallow.

There will be people for whom this is a great boat.  I'm not one of them.

-Allen
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SBD

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Like I said, not for every one, but I will continue to love this yak.  I'll order the next one to fit those with Conan calves :smt027

A few clarifications:

Quote
The cutouts along the rail on either side of seat area let water in

Not only do they let water in, they let it out.  The cut outs reduce the amount of residual water post-surf launch by many gallons, while ensuring that the fish box doesn't flood.  The next update will have no cutouts and a higher fishbox, and venturi scuppers.  I honestly think this is going the wrong way, but oh well.

Quote
Rear tank well is shallow.

Indeed.  However it is made to be used in conjunction with a custom crate that comes with it, I just haven't found a need to have it...so it is holding towels in the shop, which it does with EASE  :smt003


surfingmarmot

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I am interested in this trend towards more efficient sea kayaks that are better outfitted for the serious fishing paddler.
I am sorry I missed the chance to paddle the Dorado at Mendo. I wish KasKazi had a dealr in Nor Cal so I could try one for a while.


SBD

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Thats going to be me hopefully, I am now accepting orders, demos are free.


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  • Salmon
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Hey Scwafish,

The Dorado sounds SWEET!!  What's the lead time like?  Any pricing info yet?

Thanks for the great write-up.

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surfingmarmot

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Sean,
Let me know if a Dorado finds its way down to the Bay Area. Going to test paddle a Macski as well and would really like to compare.
The Macski has some interesting innovations like the clear plastic box top one can put the sonar and GPS under--safe and dry yet easily visible to the paddler.
But it doesn't have a rear tank well whcih I am not sure about. I need to try out both.

As for the critiques on storage space, I like a minimalist design that forces one to keep it simple--I climbed in that 'light is right' alpine style as well. Yvon Chouinard (famous alpine climber and founder of Balck Diamnd Equipment and Patagonia Clothing) made a sage observation about lightness 30 years ago when
he said something along these lines: "many climbers add a lot of gear for safety but it slows them down so much, they need for it becomes a self-fulfilling prophesy. Weather, ice falls, time in the chutes exposed to ice and rockfall catch up to you. If you climb light, speed will often keep you out of trouble."

I beleive that true in the surf zone and running from bad conditions or boomers in the ocean as well.


SBD

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Marmot:

My Dodo will be making the rounds all winter...feel free to steal it for a cruise.

Backslider:

The Dodo in glass is going to be around $1800, and a bit over 2K in epoxy.  The wait is about 8-10 weeks once I have assembled enough orders.


ScottThornley

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I think that my mountain background is a prime reason that I'm a firm believer in the adage "Speed is safety". I got totally hosed one mid-October night, having to bivuac at around 12,500' after summiting North Palisade. I went light, and got my partner to agree to "go light" as well. Unfortunately, his definition of light was to leave the kitchen sink back at base camp, but bring practically everything else. He was much slower on the descent than I was. We lost daylight about an hour and a half away from base camp, back before decent headlamps were available. So we'd crash until I got really freekin cold. Then we'd pick our way along the traverse with our pathetic lamps until I warmed up. Then bivy again. I did get to sleep on the rope though. It was a Looonnngg night. Partner had plenty of insulation layers. I had mid-weight synthetic underwear and waterproof/breathable shells. Ever since then, I'm always in a hurry...

Scott


SBD

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Nxst time were drinking beer all tell you a story about an old friend who went too light, epic hike, humiliating recovery!
« Last Edit: October 18, 2006, 08:57:56 AM by scwafish »


polepole

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I think that my mountain background is a prime reason that I'm a firm believer in the adage "Speed is safety". I got totally hosed one mid-October night, having to bivuac at around 12,500' after summiting North Palisade. I went light, and got my partner to agree to "go light" as well. Unfortunately, his definition of light was to leave the kitchen sink back at base camp, but bring practically everything else.

Well then,therein lies the problem.  You and your partner were totally out of sync.  It had nothing to do with speed being safety, because the speed of your partner was underestimated.  Safety is knowing your limits for the circumstance presented, whether you're going light or going heavy.

-Allen
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surfingmarmot

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Quote
Well then,therein lies the problem.  You and your partner were totally out of sync.  It had nothing to do with speed being safety,
But it does I think. If they both were over loaded, they were still exposed to dangers bivying that they could have avoided--they would have both been warm but no safer, In more extreme environments, they could have been caught by a thunderstorm or snow storm with that delay. Heck OCtober in the Sierra can dump on you. Or subjected to ice and rockfall. one and half hours from camp on North Pal, assuming they camped at Sam Mack Meadow, means they were on 5.4 or greater vertical rock and above the bergschrund of the glacier with high exposure.

Quote from: polepole
Safety is knowing your limits for the circumstance presented, whether you're going light or going heavy.

True. But we were getting to another aspect of speed. Often speed means you never get into the situation where you need all that equipment. Of course the speed is safety method requries you balance you equpment and skill to the measure of risk you are willing to bear--but that's true of all climbing styles.

Speed keeps your exposure time in the danger zones (couloirs, bergschrunds, etc.) as short as possible and also means that when you decide to retreat you can do it fast. Climbers who carry too much often get into the couloirs late and don't get out after sunrise and so are exposed to rockfall and ice fall the speed climbers never see. they also tire themselves and their retreats through danger are slower because of their state and extra load. That's what Yvon Chouinard was getting at and what I am seeign as a parallel with kayaks.

More efficient and fast boats get us out and in faster, let us retreat faster, and tire us less in wind and on long paddles meaning we have a reserve of strength we otherwise might not if conditions deteriorate. I am not talking about ditching the safety equipment, I am talking about hull efficiency and conservation of energy and well as significantly faster water speed with no extra cost in energy output.


polepole

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This discussion can go circular in a hurry.  Speed, or lack thereof, has its time and place.  Speed is relative.  I know some people here that can paddle a Cobra FND faster than some people here can paddle a P15.  And some people here don't at all look comfortable on a P15, spending much of their energy trying to balance.  If they rode a FND, they might be a lot more comfortable on the water.  Sometimes we get too caught up on what the "absolute best way" is and ignore the "best way given the circumstances".  The variable here is the ability of the individual.

BTW, I do have a little mountaineering background.  I was never fast nor was I that strong at elevation.  But I always made it up and down safely.

-Allen
Sponsored and Supported by: Ocean Kayak Pro Staff, Kokatat Ambassador, Big Hammer, Humminbird 
Owner: NorCalKayakAnglers.com, NorthWestKayakAnglers.com
Publisher: KayakFishingMagazine.net, TheMilkcrateMag.com
Admin: Aquahunters.com


surfingmarmot

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The variable here is the ability of the individual.

Good point and good to keep it out front there to remind everyone we are talking about us each making our own individual assessments for ourselves. Any guildelines like "speed is safety" need to be taken in that context: a general principle which can be materially changed by accounting for an individuals abilities, skill, expereince, judgment, and conditions. Not ot mention tastes  :smt003


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  • Salmon
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Hey Scwafish (or anyone else with the knowledge),

How does performance and fishability of the Dodo compare with a P15 or Tarpon 16?  Is there a marked improvement in either... enough to warrant a 2.5x increase in price?  Don't get me wrong... I'm a BIG fan of glass and epoxy... and the Dodo's "wow" factor is definitely immense (that is one pretty kayak) , but is there really that much of a difference in the "functionality" of these three vessels?

Thanks for helping out a nube... or is that newb?

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SBD

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These boats certainly paddle better (if you fit).  Do they fish better???....that is all relative,and dependant on what your doing and where your going.  They are more accurately marketed as the next thing, for the fisherman who has grown into paddling, and wants to maximize the enjoyment of both pursuits....fishing and paddling simultaneously.

Regardless, I think these would be a poor choice for a newb, unless you were an experienced kayaker first, fisherman second.