Knots-braid to mono

Did you know there is a branch of mathematics that is devoted to knots?  There are also international gatherings of knot-tyers!   Wouldn't leave you much time for fishing tho!

Several months ago I saw tiny, yet strong swivels that can fit through guides w/o snagging.  Anyone heard of these or use these?

It would make re-tying leader or topshot much easier on the water.  Just tie a couple of palomars and your done.  Big deal for those of use who get seasick...   

SPRO wind on swivels.  I've never used them.

-Allen

Thanks Allen.  Here's the one I was thinking of on the Charkbait site:  http://www.charkbait.com/cs/csh5_QRig.htm  scroll to the bottom.

You know ... I think almost any small swivel would work.  Most people (including me) seem to use swivels that are way beyond 20 pound breaking strength.  You'd be surprised how small a 20# breaking strength swivel is.  Even the smallest quickrig power swivel at the charkbait site is rated for 60#.

-Allen

I use this knot. Super strong.
Alberto's knot

I have been using an albright knot to connect 15lb Powerpro to 20lb mono topshot.

TWICE, while tying the knot, I've had the PP cut the mono.

I use saliva as lube when I'm tightening the knot and use 21 twists in the Albright.  The knot looks pretty good and tight, but I can't figure out what happened.  Has anyone else experienced this??
Is 15lb PP, too small a diameter?  Am I cynching down to tight when I finish my knots?

Other than these two incidents, I've yet to have the knot give out when connecting PP to Mono.

I think I'll try the uni to uni going forward.

Stuart

I have had some albrights that last forever, others for a short time.  there just seems to be a lot of variation in
how I tighten them down. I think a good albright is hard to beat, but a bad one can look great but fail quickly.

One thing is to just pull on it good and hard and test it first. Stu, if you tie a good one, and it survives the pull
test, you are probably good to go, I think your good albright will outperform the uni-to-uni, but the uni-to-uni
is more consistent. maybe tie the uni-to-uni on the water, the albright at home?

I don't know about pulling a swivel through your guides, I mean most of us use level wind reels, the swivel won't
go there, the charkbait stuff is for non-level wind reels and ones that have pretty big spools and rods with large
guides.

PP is  just too damn thin and has a tendency to cut mono.  Any time your tying a knot with it and it rides over the mono be careful.  Remember to moisten and pull tightly slowly.

I've not tried the albright for this connection.  I have used it for connecting 30# mono to 130# leader for marlin.  It's a solid knot when the diameters are really different and one is really large.  For some reason, I've never thought it would be good on 30# line and below.  I always think the doubled end will pull though.  Larger mono doesn't pull though a bend very easily and offers more surface area for the knot to grip.  But that's just my thinking, I have no way to really prove it.  When joining smaller lines (30# and less) I like to have knots in both the lines to prevent slippage.

So all this discussion and I really can't complain about a uni-to-uni with the spectra doubled.  I can complain about it when the spectra is not doubled.  But I did find the article interesting and I am comfortable tying the bimini so I'll give it a go.  Practice with the bimini if you decide to go that way as it is a hard knot to learn, but once you get used to it, it's not so bad if you tie it before getting out on the water in a kayak.  if you can't get the bimini down, try the Australian Plait instead.  Once on the water, if I have to tie a splice, I'll still go with the doubled uni-to-uni.

John, I wouldn't say most of us use level winds.  I only have 1 Aby 6500 (and the level wind is broken right now).  The rest of my reels are not level wind.  That being said I still don't know about pulling a swivel through the guides.  it just seems like it will catch on whatever guides you use, even big ones.

-Allen

good point about level wind, maybe it is just half of us, time for a poll,  .

If your abu is fried, you could convert it to non-level wind with bar and stainless pinion for about $15 with
some custom machined stuff from dkstenson on ebay. plus you get to read his crazy english.
I converted a 4600 and 5501.

For double line, I never tried to tie a bimini, I use a surgeons loop to make the double line,
not as strong, but super easy, even on the water. But I am not tuna fishing either.

The albright goes through a level wind guide, and around spinning reel bails and
through tiny guides. it is as svelte a knot as they get. heavy leader like 40/50 lb does not go through
the level wind guide unless the knot is svelte.

That is one reason I used it to join 5-8lb mono to 30lb leader or 20-30lb spectra to 40lb leader, but unless it
is cinched down perfectly (I get it right about one in two tries) it has issues with spectra.

Good points Allen.  I'm definitely moving away from the albright and strictly doing a uni to uni.

Stuart

Speaking of svelte ... a dab of super glue on the knot is your friend.

I haven't even had the time to take a look at the Abu.  I just switched it out for another one of me reels.  I may just try that conversion.  But now that I think about it, I have 2 level winds.   

For tuna fishing, I splice 20# mono to 20# flouro leader.  I use a Stren J knot for that application.  I've tried every other knot known to man and was a uni-to-uni knot user for a long time.  But in a hot and heavy bite you need to be able to change out your leader and get your bait in the water pretty damn quick.  The J knot is the quickest I can tie that I'm satisfied with it's strength in that application.  A surgeon's knot would be slightly quicker but I wasn't satisfied with it.  I'm a bit of a knot freak if you can't tell.  If I ever lose a fish to a bad knot, well ... I get a little upset.   



-Allen

Molbasser:
Our cabezone are really good at diving into rocks when you hook them.  Lings and other rockfish also do this sometimes (so do WSB) that's one of my main reasons for using a heavy leader.

Heavy spectra is easy to break since it doesn't strech, just point the rod straight down, reel in the slack at the bottom of a swell and grab the spool.  The swell will lift you up and break the line just like that.  Doesn't work for mono because it can strech up to 20% before breaking. 

That report on different knots between 20lb spectra and 50lb mono wasn't that enlightening.  Was it the mono or the spectra that broke?  Did the mono break at the knot or did the spectra cut it?  How did that compare to the same knot from 50lb mono to 50lb mono?  Is the knot bad for spectra to mono, or just bad in general?

All fish that live near rocks are a pain to get away from those rocks.  Calicos on SoCal jetties are very hard to rip away from their favourite haunts.

I am just personally uncomfortable hooked to a snag with anything greater than 20# test in a kayak.

Part of what I am rigging for is fishing in the kelp and not bottom fishing rock structure so I want something a little less stiff, hence the 12#.  My bigger deeper rockfishing rod has 60# spectra with 20# fluoro leader.

MolBasser

That report on different knots between 20lb spectra and 50lb mono wasn't that enlightening.  Was it the mono or the spectra that broke?  Did the mono break at the knot or did the spectra cut it?  How did that compare to the same knot from 50lb mono to 50lb mono?  Is the knot bad for spectra to mono, or just bad in general?

I found it somewhat enlightening but not complete.  The doubled through palomar was news to me and you can bet I'll be using it when tying spectra to swivels.  The rating of lines was very useful in terms of overstrength and cost.  I'm beginning to think 20# spectra is overkill for what I want to do since it overtests by such a large amount.  I'll probably try out some cheaper Tuf Line as well.  And the info on a 12 turn bimini was completely opposite what I've always been led to believe.  I don't think 50# mono to mono tests would be applicable because spectra to mono is a completely different ballgame.  I believe most of the knots he used were "good" knots in the mono only arena.  And yes, I do wish he had done 20# spectra to 20# mono tests and shown how much below the weaker line the knot breaks at.

Mol, why the 60# ROPE on your deepwater rigs?

-Allen