Rock and Bottom Fish on the fly

Good job Man
8 cabs in a row, Wow, now that would be fun
I've been using some light tackle lately, but fly's ...

Thanks for the Report

I bet that's fun!

Don't let him get started!  I did, and now I'm sitting in a kayak on the front lawn trying to work out an effective cast with a 9wt, fast sinking line and heavy flies (that his flies inspired me to start tying for myself).

suf12foot, I didn't know your Beulah kayak rod was 11 feet long.  Maybe that's why my piddly 9'6" seems to be a PITA to toss more than 40' from the kayak...  I like to blame gear, not my own failings.

Good day out there and nice fish.

Tinker, your line might not match your rod. I use 9' rods and can throw 60'+ easily in my kayak.

Tinker, your line might not match your rod. I use 9' rods and can throw 60'+ easily in my kayak.

I'd bet you know what you're doing, whereas I, on the other hand, am dumb, and I may not yet be smart enough to be called dumb.

I can fling a fly 60 feet out the kayak with a 6wt.  The 9wt is new to me, and so too are using a heavy-tipped sinking line and jumbo-sized heavy flies.  At the moment, while I can get a fly out 60 feet or more, only the Lords of Fishing know where the fly is going to land on casts longer than 30-feet.

In fact, a couple of days ago, I dragged the kayak into the front yard to practice and hooked a trophy-sized yucca tree that was holding 30 feet to the right of where I intended the fly to land...

I think that, right now, with this rod, it's a question of leverage when I'm sitting down and balance when I'm in the kayak.  Neither one feels natural to me on its own, and when combined, it's a whole different ball game.

So how are you casting?  I've been trying a Belgian cast, but I have no idea if that's the most effective cast to use from a kayak.

Sounds like all my fly experience 

LoL I pretty much suck at throwing fly lines gracefully, but sometimes the fish just don't care and hammer the offering anyway.
If you are looking to fill the freezer or exclusively catch huge specimens fly fishing may not be the end-all.
When you do hook up it will be memorable

Tinker, your line might not match your rod. I use 9' rods and can throw 60'+ easily in my kayak.

I'd bet you know what you're doing, whereas I, on the other hand, am dumb, and I may not yet be smart enough to be called dumb.

I can fling a fly 60 feet out the kayak with a 6wt.  The 9wt is new to me, and so too are using a heavy-tipped sinking line and jumbo-sized heavy flies.  At the moment, while I can get a fly out 60 feet or more, only the Lords of Fishing know where the fly is going to land on casts longer than 30-feet.

In fact, a couple of days ago, I dragged the kayak into the front yard to practice and hooked a trophy-sized yucca tree that was holding 30 feet to the right of where I intended the fly to land...

I think that, right now, with this rod, it's a question of leverage when I'm sitting down and balance when I'm in the kayak.  Neither one feels natural to me on its own, and when combined, it's a whole different ball game.

So how are you casting?  I've been trying a Belgian cast, but I have no idea if that's the most effective cast to use from a kayak.

I use a standard double haul for casting.

Are you using shooting heads?  I love shooting heads. Maybe we could get together and I can watch you cast. Maybe I can help you out.

I pretty much fish every weekend somewhere. Just let me know if you want to hook up.

No, I'm not using shooting heads on the 9wt.  I'm using an integrated sinking line - for the first time, ever.

To me, it feels like I have a (relatively) massive amount of weight zipping much too fast way too close to my head, and if I dragged my camera out to get a video of what I'm doing, I'd bet that I'm casting like I'm afraid of the fly (or fond of my ears).  Because I am concerned.  On my very first cast with yarn and split shot, I gave it a heroic heave and bounced the "fly" off the back of my head.

I'd welcome an opportunity for a day on the water with you.  We'll try to connect sometime this year as long as you promise to stay at a safe distance.   

No, I'm not using shooting heads on the 9wt.  I'm using an integrated sinking line - for the first time, ever.

Try using a shooting head style line w/ thin running line.  It's pretty much required for our windy conditions and for distance.  You can make your own shooting heads, but either way it's key to get the head tuned to your rod, and this involves some practice casts to properly locate the line's hinge-point.


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Saw the problem right away the other day - I've been using 10-12 foot leaders and there's no loop or turnover with sinking line and T-18 using leaders that long - the fly just drags behind the line...

Saw the problem right away the other day - I've been using 10-12 foot leaders and there's no loop or turnover with sinking line and T-18 using leaders that long - the fly just drags behind the line...

for saltwater and heavy fly throwing I use short 3'-4' 20 pound mono leaders with maybe a 2 foot butt section of 30.

I changed to a short 30# leader and short 15# tippet and don't have to duck my head for safety anywhere near as often.

Had a chance to go out with surf12foot and he put me on a decent black rockfish.  And yes, there isn't a lot that compares with taking a rockfish on the fly.  I think my half of the conversation went from "I'm hung in the kelp" to "Fish!" to "I think it's a lingcod!" - but it was only an 18 inch rockfish.  Felt twice that size on a fly rod.

surf12foot does mostly C&R, but that guy could fill two freezers after a day on the water.  Fascinating to watch him.

Just a follow-up on all the great advice I've received.

I've dialed things in.  I've switched to an intermediate running line with 18' of T-14 (T-18 when needed).  From the sink tip, I'm using a 12" length of 30# Maxima attached with a nail knot, and about 9' of 15# level mono leader to the fly.

The hinges are mostly eliminated and I can pitch a Clouser 50-feet, without hauling, all day without wearing out my shoulder now that suf12foot has taught me to slow down and stop worrying about tight loops.  Thank you, Scott.

This rigging can be a butt-pain when I break off a leader, but the difference in casting is worth it.  I'll work with a loop-to-loop connection from the sink tip to the leader this year.
 
It wasn't a simple transition from fishing for trout with dry flies to fishing for bottom fish, but it's definitely worth the effort.

Thanks to Scurvy and ScottV and surf12foot, I'm addicted...  Thanks, guys.
   

Good going Tinker.

Isn't it nice to cast a fly rod when the line matches!!  Now go catch some fish and post some pics.