Yelloweyes & Vermilions

I know this has probably been beat to death, but I keep seeing pictures of fish, I would classify as Yelloweyes (from my knowledge of the DFG pictures), but the posters say they are Vermilions.  What is a guaranteed way of telling the difference?  I caught this fish on Saturday at Fort Ross and released it as a Yelloweye.  Its eye ring was yellow!  Any and all clarification is appreciated.

Nice yelloweye.

You can feel under the jawbone.  If it's rough, it's a vermillion.  Smooth, and it's not and probably on the "red" fish we can't keep.

Earlier this year at the NWKA derby in Neah Bay, WA, one of the guys caught a nice red fish I was sure was a vermillion.  But being that I've never seen one caught in WA I started having my doubts.  I couldn't remember which way if was, rough and vermillion, or smooth in vermillion.  So we released it.  Of course it was rough and it was a vermillion that we released.  Usually I can just tell at first glance.

-Allen

Looks like a yelloweye to me from this distance.  The thing to look for besides the obvious yellow eye is the anal fin.  Vermilions have a pointed anal fin and yellow eyes have a rounded one.  I'll try and find some good photos.

Brian

Will these do Brian?..............

Thanks for the responses and the pictures.  Which of the two does this red fish look like to you?

The rough chin thing is the way to go when you are on the water.  A quick swipe with your finger along the jaw and you know.

Thanks for the responses and the pictures.  Which of the two does this red fish look like to you?

Vermillion...

The eye on a vermillion has a light ring that is kinda orangeish, but those yelloweyes really have a distinctive yellow color to the eye.

I also think that the yelloweyes tend to have a lighter sort of orange-ish coloration to them... I'm sure there is variability, but that's how I see it.

Also, look at the anal fin (the one on the underside of the tail)... kinda pointy.

Here's another pic of some big vermillions...

Man, no need to zoom in to see any the detail the Vermillion or Yellow eye examples.  Great pics!

Looks like a yelloweye to me from this distance.  The thing to look for besides the obvious yellow eye is the anal fin.  Vermilions have a pointed anal fin and yellow eyes have a rounded one.  I'll try and find some good photos.

So Brian, you didn't mention the rough jaw underside. Is there areason youomitted it--unrelaible? Too subjective perhaps? Me, I use the anal fin because, as the photos show, its clear demarcation between the species. Having not seen a Yelloweye in person, I am a bit hesitant to use the eye color. Any pics of the eyes to show the difference. Next time I catch a Vermillion that size (yeah right like years from now  ) I'll take a better pick.

I have used the jaw thing a lot, and I don't have to even take the fish from the water to do it!!.........

I didn't mention the rouch jaw thing becuase I don't use it often and it doesn't help me when I'm looking at just photos.  I pretty much have canaries figured out by sight at this point and I haven't actually caught a yelloweye so I haven't had to worry about that.  I'm sure the moment I catch a yelloweye I'll be quickly appraising it... Does it have a yellow eye, what does the anal fin look like, how about the rough chin...etc.. hopefully I can do that quickly enough to ensure a quick release if it is a yelloweye.  I could go completely the other way and bring out a scientific key and start counting fin rays and gill rakers, but I don't think a fish could survive that long out of water.

Seabreeze,
Thanks. Since you've caught both that's a good testamonial to the effectiveness of the jaw identifier. I'll try it next time whenever that will be. Bean Hollow is great but you never know waht conditions are going to be like there.

Brian,
Here's hoping we soon both boat have nice specimens of both to pracitce quick identification on 

Brian, the Alaska F&G is adamant that you do not release yellow eyes because they are terrifically fragile.  While I had no doubt what I had caught as I saw that radiant fish floating up to my boat, I stroked its chin just out of habit.  And he was almost totally dead.  I was fishing for halibut and would have happily let him return to his deep home but he was a floater before I even layed eyes on him. 

I carry a barbless hook on a weight to return fish, but I can't see it working on a large fish like that.  It would be a total bummer to hook one here.

A couple small Rockfish I caught Sunday had their bladder poppinginto their throats up from only 70 feet ( I though one had to be well over 100 but obviously I am mistaken). I hoep if I do catch a Yellow Eye I can release it unharmed. I am assuming from teh discussio nthat they are quite deep-dwelling and suffer significatn baro-trauma when bought up.

the barbless hook for release sound like a good idea--if you tie the line to the bend and the weight to the eye, a quick pull on the line after lettign the weight drag them down should pop them off nicely. I assume that's how you rig it?

Yes.  but I have had a ballooned copper that I couldn't get down.........so we invited him to lunch..............   Something twice that size I know that I couldn't get down.

In fact, that experience with the copper has me fishing 90 feet or less again.........well, except for dabs of course.